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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Therougetitan View Post
    Dungeon journal: "Now living outside of time, Murozond was once the great Dragon Aspect Nozdormu the Timeless One. After the titans showed him his own death, the tormented Nozdormu was tricked by the Old Gods into trying to subvert his mortality. As a result, Nozdormu shattered the timeways and created the infinite dragonflight... jeopardizing the very future of Azeroth."

    Underlined important part. Nozdormu was immortal before Dragon Soul, as were the other aspects. Now they are mortal. This is the timeline he'll go crazy, we just don't know when.
    Immortal doesn't mean he can't die. It just means he won't die of old age. He could still die of unnatural causes.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

    RPG is non-canon by default. (MickyNeilson)

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Noorri View Post
    The "End Time" dungeon is an alternate timeline where Deathwing wins and destroys Azeroth. If Deathwing won Nozdormu didn't use all his power to power the Dragon Soul to kill Deathwing and would still have his power.

    While there are a bazillion things that doesn't make sense in WoW lore, that one actually does make sense. Kinda...
    But if we can visit his timeline, what is stopping him from wreaking havoc in other timelines?
    How many timelines are there?
    Is there a timeline in which Murozond becomes the supreme ruler of the world? Does he stop at that or does he take over the other timelines too?

    WoW characters that need/deserve to get killed/punished/otherwise removed from the story: Tirion*, Thrall, Malfurion, Wrathion, Sylvanas, Jaina

  3. #23
    Not a paradox.

    In End Time, the aspects ceased to be after the battle with Deathwing. As such, Nozdormu in that timeline was no longer timeless, and he became Murozond.

    In THAT timeline, he was not timeless. As such, he split from the main Nozdormu.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Immortal doesn't mean he can't die. It just means he won't die of old age. He could still die of unnatural causes.
    Immortality has a broad scope; from only being able to be killed by being beheaded, or always existing so long as your soul remains intact in a safe location.

    In short, the definition of immortality depends on the context it is being used.
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thimagryn View Post
    The whole 'why did we go back to Hyjal' during TBC was not explained either, esp since the Infinites had absolutely no presence there.
    In the intro to the Caverns of Time, where you get escorted around and shown the various timeways, the guide mentions that the Infinites are doing something in Hyjal--the Bronzes just don't know what. So they send us there to make sure it goes according to history. It never came up in the raid itself, though, for some reason...the Infinites never appeared there.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaese View Post
    Immortality has a broad scope; from only being able to be killed by being beheaded, or always existing so long as your soul remains intact in a safe location.

    In short, the definition of immortality depends on the context it is being used.
    Yea.... and in the context of WoW, the Aspects could still be killed even when they were immortal.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

    RPG is non-canon by default. (MickyNeilson)

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazomir View Post
    Yeah but its not the real timeline. If Nozdormu didn't became Murozond in the real timeline, how could Murozond ever have existed to screw with other timelines ?
    I don't think "real" timeline is the right word. Current timeline, perhaps? The timeline in which Murozond exists is the real timeline for Murozond existing. Im sure that there is plenty of Murozond muckery in other timelines going on before the one in which Deathwing dies

  8. #28
    From what i remember reading somewhere, (not really sure where, but for some reason i remember it) everything in caverns of time was events that the infinite dragons were interferring with because they were trying to prevent their own deaths. End Time was part of a progression line, Nozdormu was trying to send us back in time to the well of eternity, but there was a time anomoly in the timeways preventing us from travelling anywhere but that point. Even Noz didnt know what the anomoly was, but he assumed it had to be himself, because only he was powerful enough to stop himself. But since End Time happens in a future where Deathwing wins, that means the Old Gods won too...which might mean Murozond might actually be the Old God infection of Noz, and makes him powerful enough to stop Nozdormu, if not for us helping in End Time.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Therougetitan View Post
    Dungeon journal: "Now living outside of time, Murozond was once the great Dragon Aspect Nozdormu the Timeless One. After the titans showed him his own death, the tormented Nozdormu was tricked by the Old Gods into trying to subvert his mortality. As a result, Nozdormu shattered the timeways and created the infinite dragonflight... jeopardizing the very future of Azeroth."

    Underlined important part. Nozdormu was immortal before Dragon Soul, as were the other aspects. Now they are mortal. This is the timeline he'll go crazy, we just don't know when.
    Sometime in the near future, when Blizzard introduce expansions with fighting last stands of Old God(s?) that would involve Titans, I guess. With defeating last Sha, only N'zoth remains, so maybe Blizz introduce one (few) more Old Gods. Or, they can just say he was contacted in his dream by Titans which showed him his death.

  10. #30
    Cant help but think of this every time someone brings up time travel paradoxes.



    Also paradoxes largely resolve themselves, eventually.
    My name is Cernunnos, I will love you like no other, I have died a thousand deaths, each time I died I thought of you.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Vasti View Post
    But if we can visit his timeline, what is stopping him from wreaking havoc in other timelines?
    How many timelines are there?

    Now, that is serious question. I would like to know answer from Blizzard. For example, If we stopped Infinite dragonflights at Stratholme to kill Arthas, who would stop them to kill Arthas as baby? Or past timeline is constant that couldn't be changed, but they found some anomalies that allow them to alter the past and change future?

  12. #32
    And thats why you never introduce time travel into your fiction.

    Ever.
    The common man is like a worm in the gut of a corpse, trapped inside a prison of cold flesh, helpless and uncaring, unaware even of the inevitability of its own doom.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazomir View Post
    So i've been thinking, how exactly Murozond (Nozdormu's corrupted form) came to be?

    Since Nozdormu lost his powers to travel in time and affect it BEFORE he became Murozond (the Age of Mortals is upon us) , how did Murozond ever exist?

    This whole Time travel stuff is Tauren excrements!
    Actually where does it say he lost his time travel power? You know just because the Aspects lost their "Aspect" powers doesn't mean they can't do what they did before. Think of it this way, did anyone else other than Nozdormu ever travel in time? If yes, then why wouldn't it be possible for them to travel in time still just because Nozdormu lost his Aspect powers? If no, then how come we see so many bronze dragons travel in time?

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kazomir View Post
    Yeah but its not the real timeline. If Nozdormu didn't became Murozond in the real timeline, how could Murozond ever have existed to screw with other timelines ?
    Stop making me think. STOP!

  15. #35
    there are millions of different timelines and outcomes. just because he didnt get created in this one doesnt mean he wasnt in some other timeline. also wibbly wobbly timey wimey

    - - - Updated - - -

    wait,. i just remembered something. didnt noz bind all the timelines together after deathwing died so it always happened? how does that work then O_o
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
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  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Spl4sh3r View Post
    Actually where does it say he lost his time travel power? You know just because the Aspects lost their "Aspect" powers doesn't mean they can't do what they did before. Think of it this way, did anyone else other than Nozdormu ever travel in time? If yes, then why wouldn't it be possible for them to travel in time still just because Nozdormu lost his Aspect powers? If no, then how come we see so many bronze dragons travel in time?
    In Dawn of the Aspects, Ysera says the Druids have to protect the Emerald Dream from the slowly again expanding Nightmare because the green flight lost their power to enter the dream. Therefore it is only logical that the other flights also lost their abilities.

    In both the Dungeon Journal and the Thrall book, it is said that the Old Gods eventually turn Nozdormu into Murozand. The Old God must have some time travel/bending powers, else they wouldn't have been able to cause that distortion so the War of the Ancients would have happened differently so they could have escaped. So Old Gods probably gave Nozdormu/Murozand his time travel powers back (although not as powerfull as his aspect self).

    Murozand, just like Nozdormu, exist in every time. Not to forget Murozand says that the End Time we see is like a walk in the park compared to the TRUE horrors of the even worse version of End Time. Alternate possible timeline Murozand can also exist. He did sent Alternate timeline Blackmoore after Thrall to kill him. So an "alternate timeline" Murozand will probably also exist.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazomir View Post
    So i've been thinking, how exactly Murozond (Nozdormu's corrupted form) came to be?

    Since Nozdormu lost his powers to travel in time and affect it BEFORE he became Murozond (the Age of Mortals is upon us) , how did Murozond ever exist?

    This whole Time travel stuff is Tauren excrements!
    Look at his model in End Time. I'm guessing he gets empowered by someone, or something, down the road, either driving him mad or after he goes mad. Just because he lost his powers at the end of Cata doesn't mean he can't, for example, be empowered by an old god in the future, and I think the corrupted look of the infinite dragonflight is good support for this theory.

  18. #38
    what i don't understand is that, from what has been said in the game before, nozdormu is supposed to be a constant in time. how can there be a second him?


    oh well though, take a listen to this dialogue, the bronze flight is starting their descent http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=Mmsq3hlenOM

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by dirk123 View Post
    In Dawn of the Aspects, Ysera says the Druids have to protect the Emerald Dream from the slowly again expanding Nightmare because the green flight lost their power to enter the dream. Therefore it is only logical that the other flights also lost their abilities.
    It never said they lost their power to enter the dream, but the former Aspects for the most part were not as interested in being defenders anymore because they did lost a lot of power. As such, the Druids need to pick up some of the slack. This was the whole point of the story, the fracturing of the Accord.

    Again, just because the Aspects lost much of the powers they held does not mean they lost all of them. Nozdormu may not be able to hold millions of time-ways together like he did in the War of the Ancients Trilogy, but he still has dominion of many time-based powers. Kalec is still a master of the arcane flows. Ysera still a beacon of nature, and Alexstrazsa still a queen of life. Becoming weaker does not mean becoming neutered.

  20. #40
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Q. In the Cataclysm finale, the Dragon Aspects became mortals. But are they still powerful dragons that just lost the blessing of the Titans?
    Yes. For example, the bronze dragons can still travel through time, but they are no longer able to control the flow of time. The blue dragons are still powerful mages, but no longer control the magic of Azeroth. Therefore, in Age of Mortals, mortals themselves need to take over what used to be the responsibility of the Aspects. (Source)
    Last edited by Aquamonkey; 2013-07-13 at 04:44 AM. Reason: better translation
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

    RPG is non-canon by default. (MickyNeilson)


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