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Guest Ian

Goodbye

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Guest Ian

Dear Moderators

 

It is with great regret that I have decided to delete my account here (if only I could be told how to achieve this). When I joined this site I was keen to get involved in one or two topics of debate and listen to other opinions which may teach me to look at things from another perspective, and on ocassions this has happened.

 

Then Mr HobGoblin decided to don his Mugabe hat and tell people how things were and would not entertain any notion of defiance to his opinion. Much as I enjoyed this 'battle', it was really Mr Hobgoblin driving in the fast lane flashing his lights at anyone who slowed him down. Ocassionally he would let me pull into the fast lane in front, but would be seething at me and waiting his time to slip into the middle lane and undertake me. However, when Kimberley decided to block my road by slanting at my wife to score points on Mr Hobgoblin's behalf, this was a step too far.

 

Mr HobGoblin wants to come across as intellectual - 'interlocutor' indeed - how pretentious; but his singleminded obsession with having a go at a dying woman because of how she chose to live her final months, almost wishing she would hurry up and die, is just evil. He lives a blinkered life, and a sad one as he wastes so much time and energy trying to portray one image of himself in order to be looked upon more favourably, (perhaps this is a false impression to portray as it is an effort), instead of being himself.

 

Well, Mr HobGoblin (and Kimberley), play your games in the fast lane of the motorway which is BGO, my exit sliproad is just ahead and I'm getting off.

 

I'm far better than both of you, but you will never see that.

 

Adios.

 

ps, now, where's that 'delete your account' button?

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It is impossible to delete your own account so I will PM Bill and ask him to do it for you, Ian.

 

I'll wait a day or so to ensure that's what you really want - remember you did leave us before because of flak in discussion but eventually you decided you would like to come back.

 

As you know I disagreed myself with a lot of what Mr HG said, but that's the nature of discussion, isn't it? He has controversial views that ruffle feathers from time to time, but then so do you. Every now and again a strong discussion reaches kerfuffle level but then it blows over and everything returns to normal. I've exchanged some fruity words with other members occasionally and have been annoyed by some of their stances, but we've continued to get on just fine. That's the way it goes.

 

As I said, I'll wait a couple of days before contacting Bill to delete your account so if you change your mind just let me know.

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Ian, although I haven't taken part in any of the discussions, I've watched the sparks flying and been reminded of 'real life' (?) arguments I've been involved in.

I think you should ponder David's wise words and not leave the forum without very careful thought. You should also remember that the whole of civilisation is basically a history of ongoing disagreements. And that exchanges of opinion in words constitute one of the best ways of dealing with them. Better than nuclear war, for example...

I have met MisterHobgoblin in 'real life' (re-?) and can vouch that he is hardly to be compared with people perpetrating road rage on the motorway, virtual or otherwise... He has, as the expression goes, the courage of his convictions in many areas, and I think that it always a good thing.

I also think it is particularly unfortunate to try to bring your disagreements to an end in the following way:

I'm far better than both of you

as it is a silly declaration of moral superiority... come on, even ex-President Bush would have thought twice about bringing his arguments down to the level of "The United States is a better country than Iraq"...

 

These things shouldn't get out of control. I speak with the experience of one whose membership, without warning or explanation of any kind, was deleted from a discussion forum I actively participated in previous to this one. The nuclear war option, in a way, except they had the button to press and I didn't.

 

Think again. Maybe after a few days' complete break?

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I personally keep out of the thread in question for such a reason as this. Perhaps it proves religion is ugly?

 

I'd urge you to leave it a few days before leaving- there are plenty of other people and threads for discussion without running into members you don't get on with.

 

When you consider how many active members we have you are always going to run into a few people you don't get on with- they same as in any other area of life.

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Yes, Ian, do think again.

As you know, I also expressed disquiet with Mr HG's views on Jade Goody on that thread. I think wishing anyone (save perhaps a mass murderer) dead is morally repugnant and actually has similarities with religious fundamentalists' points of view. And I said so, but then bowed out. But disagreeing with someone can be stimulating - reading the other person's POV, re-considering one's own opinion to see if it stands up against intellectual argument, etc. And even if you disagree on one topic, you may well agree on others, or at least find each others' posts interesting - or interestingly provocative.

 

I think there are various different stances one can take in intellectual debates. One is to snap at the heels of people with a differing viewpoint and try always to get the last word. I think this is understandable in some ways because noone likes to be misrepresented or for their opinions to be twisted or misconstrued. And I think that's what's happening in the religion thread - people on both sides of the argument are loathe to ignore comments made about them - which is understandable in some ways.

 

I would advise a different stance for both parties - state your opinions then rise above any slanging matches by ignoring personal comments made. It's difficult, I know, but sometimes it reflects better on a person, as well as saving the anxiety and distress of having a public spat online.

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Dear Ian,

I do hope that on quiet reflection you will see that BGO has a lot more to offer than Mr HG's hot air and Kimberley's, perhaps, misunderstood comment.

 

I for one refused to become embroiled in Mr. HG's denouncements of a woman who is suffering unbearably in her last weeks, days and hours of life. I admired your stance but I do hope that you will think about David's wise words and review your decision to leave us. Your contribution is always worthy and valued and there is far more that is good about BGO that one thread and one or two statements.

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Don't delete his account, just change his name to prima donna. :rolleyes:

 

 

I'm far better than both of you...
Let's look at that signature of Ian's:

I read, therefore I think - I write, therefore I thought.
Are you sure, with that "I'm far better than both of you" statement that because you wrote it it actually involved thought? Wow!

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Damn, I thought I'd be the one to force people off. Guess I'm slipping.

 

Ian, I can't help but think that if deletion of your account in a genuine effort to leave were your main objective, you would have sent a private message to one of the moderators. You're not fooling anyone by doing it like this. I'm not usually in favor of giving the squeaky wheel grease.

 

That said, I have popped into the thread in question a few times, but usually only when I needed a good laugh. Your comments in there weren't always in the best of taste either, so maybe everything is even.

 

On a totally unrelated point--but I seem to remember a thread on it somewhere before--maybe we should post more often about books. Might make things run a little more smoothly...unless we talk about Atonement, or Charles Dickens's plotting, or... :D

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Might make things run a little more smoothly...unless we talk about Atonement, or Charles Dickens's plotting, or... :D

;)

 

Well now here's a good case example, Ian. SlowRain and I have engaged in a few 'passionate disagreements' in the past and have both been sufficiently convinced of our positions to get pretty hot under the collar. Nevertheless neither of us has stormed off and we can happily share a joke about it now and again - as above.

 

It happens.

 

I hope you've seen that many people would be sorry if you left like this, but rather than expect you to post something here about it I'm simply going to say I won't ask Bill to delete your account unless I hear from you directly asking me to do so. I simply ask that you wait a few days until everything's had time to cool a bit.

 

(I should note in passing that I'm referring all this through me because I know mods are going to be thin on the ground today)

 

EDIT: I feel I should add, as Barblue has already suggested, that I do not believe Kimberley's comment was having a go at your wife; I read it simply as an ironic commentary on the observations you had made yourself.

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Guest Ian

To be honest I have found other 'debate' sites more worthwhile. Yes I know this is a BOOK group, but it has sections which relate to anything but, so I feel ok with calling this a 'debate' site. Unfortunately a lot of people find comfort in the anonymity of the internet, where in real life, they are probably trodden on and quite openly scorned by their colleagues.

 

Please delete this account, allow those smug idiots to have their moment of glory, and be satisfied that they have 'won'. It means more to them than I care to bother about.

 

To the moderators; allowing members to post such contentious morally wrong comments and asking me to accept and reconsider says more about the fact they are subscribers and I am not, than any obviously placating post you can write.

 

Thanks Stewart for your comment - I see you are a fellow Scot, but know that this is not a Scottish thing - probably a relation, work mate or close friend. All animals roam in packs.

 

For those who have been kind enough to agree with me, thanks.

 

Mr HG and Kimberley, when you've finished laughing and massaging each others ego, climb out of each others backside and take a look at the real world.

 

Seeya

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To be honest I have found other 'debate' sites more worthwhile.

Fair enough, then.

 

Please delete this account

I'll PM Bill.

 

allowing members to post such contentious morally wrong comments and asking me to accept and reconsider says more about the fact they are subscribers and I am not

Drivel.

 

You've posted contentious comments yourself previously that have offended people and have been allowed to do so. This is a site that values free speech - we don't pretend to and then ban people whose opinions we don't like. If they post things we disagree with we say so, as I did. No one's asked you to reconsider your opinion, only in kindness to suggest you might want to stay.

 

To suggest someone is given favoured treatment because they are a subscriber is laughable. Not least because no one was given favoured treatment. Mr HG's unpopular opinions were allowed to remain, as were yours.

 

probably a relation, work mate or close friend.

Not even close on any count.

 

For those who have been kind enough to agree with me, thanks.

I'm not sure anyone has, they've only tried to be generous-spirited and suggest you may want to stay.

 

Seeya

Equally wrong, it would appear.

 

What a shame you choose to leave like this. Everybody has been very patient with your contentious, provocative posting (and I'm not referring to the argument with Mr HG). I think it says everything about this site that even though you've stood up in threads and accused multiple posters of arrogance and invited people to fight, they have still posted to encourage you to stay.

 

I'm afraid you've ensured that you'll be remembered as a stroppy, toy-throwing individual who can't cope with an argument.

 

I try to be measured in responses but if after all the encouraging words offered here that's the best you can manage then I've lost patience.

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Ian - What a childish tantrum.Just because you feel you haven't "won" the debate (which is in itself debatable :D ), you choose to spit your dummy out of the pram.

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....allowing members to post such contentious morally wrong comments
Morally wrong? That's open to interpretation, especially since morals aren't some set in stone code (well, some would have you believe that, but then it's a pic 'n' mix of morals where they are concerned.) but something a person defines for themselves about what is right and wrong.
Thanks Stewart for your comment - I see you are a fellow Scot, but know that this is not a Scottish thing - probably a relation, work mate or close friend. All animals roam in packs.
Nothing fellow about it. I've met MrHobgoblin once, almost two years before, but I'm my own man and in my own mind I have my own picture of what's going on. I just agree with him in some areas where you don't. Big deal!

 

For those who have been kind enough to agree with me, thanks.
So it was all about sharing your line of thinking and damn you all if you don't? Sad. Bye.

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Ian,

I'm rather sorry I took the time to contribute to your "everybody have pity on poor me" thread this morning, when I had other/better [a favourite word of yours, I think?] things to do.

 

I now realise you are an opinionated cry-baby, and can only add that the board will be better off without you.

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Maybe we should refrain from posting more comments in this thread, no matter what our feelings. I just can't see it going anywhere good.

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I have had a look at this thread and note Ian's request that his account be deleted. However, this will mean that all his posts will automatically be by 'Guest', which can be confusing. Given that Ian is a long-standing member with a post-count of 249, I think the simplest solution would be, if Ian is unhappy, that he simply stops logging on to the site. That way, his 249 posts can remain under his name.

 

If Ian doesn't want this, then he can PM me, and I will go ahead and delete his account.

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