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Offline Evie

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #15 on: September 23, 2018, 11:59:33 pm »
In my AU version of modern Gwynedd seen in Balance of Power, there have been some technological developments to help level the playing field between Deryni and non-empowered Humans a little bit, although the Deryni subspecies still has a natural edge over the non-magical segment of humanity. There are also magical amulets and the like that humans can buy to get a certain level of protection against some forms of magic. Granted, as Laurna mentions, there are also Deryni who are leery of anything that smacks of too much control and regulation of their powers, which is one reason why even though my version of Modern Gwynedd has a law requiring the registration of personal Portals, for instance (with many Deryni even being mostly in favor of such for law enforcement purposes), even normally law-abiding Deryni sometimes ignore that particular legal requirement themselves, or they might have one registered Portal on the government's official list but might have a secondary one known only to family that can serve as a personal bolt hole should it ever become necessary to have one. Given the almost certain cyclical waxing and waning of Deryni/Human good relations over the centuries, most of my AU Deryniverse's Deryni bear no ill will towards non-magical humans, but their memories of both overt and subtle persecution over the years run deep enough that they tend to be wary of any new law, regulation, technology, science, or what-not that might potentially be turned and used against them, and whenever something comes along that seems like it could become a possible threat to Deryni sometime down the road if allowed to continue unchecked, you can bet there are countermeasures quietly put into place or currently under development against those things. Maintaining the fragile peace between regular humans and Deryni over the centuries requires a careful system of checks and balances from both sides of that divide.
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Online Laurna

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #16 on: September 24, 2018, 12:19:10 am »
It was fun reading the chat log tonight. Sorry I missed it.

When KK gave the possibility of a natural occurring Portal, that made me feel good moment. Not too long ago, on some other thread, no idea what that was about, I suggested that there might be some type of animal in the deryni world that could tune their mind toward special rocks and they could "jump" from one rock to the other, thus avoiding predictors. They might have two or three portal rocks in their family territories. They learn them from their parents. Perhaps they are family groups like rodents or mircats with tunnels to these special rocks which are underground. The ancient Deryni studied these animals wondering how they got from one tunnel mound to the other so quickly. That is when they discovered that natural portals exist. A little magical research and they find they can build larger ones that can move people.

I believe that if magic exists in this world, than nature would have found many ways to use it. Humans just happen to be the most skilled at discovering and using all the magic abilities available.

Offline whitelaughter

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #17 on: September 24, 2018, 08:39:53 am »
If drugs can interfere with a Deryni but not with another human, then chemicals would be found that could interfere with magical artifacts.
Not that these need be safe though. I dare say that this world's equivalent of Agent Orange would be a toxin designed to disrupt portals in the region, with people still suffering the long term effects of exposure.

The real advantage of improved navigation was being able to access the Far East without having to cross the Islamic world; portal chains to bring in wealth from Cathay would be both very lucrative and infuriating to the nobles whose tariffs you are bypassing. The 2nd advantage of the caravels was that their firepower was sufficient to be able to negotiate from a position of strength with any port they arrived in; Deryni magic makes that feasible as well. So merchant princes half a millennia early become possible.

The Deryni are going to take disproportionate casualties from plague though, bouncing around the world, and be a major source of outbreaks - making them even more unpopular.

Offline Evie

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #18 on: September 24, 2018, 12:59:35 pm »
Traveling to lands with the plague could definitely make them carriers. But given that Deryni have some natural immunity to disease that doesn't guarantee their safety, but which makes them more highly resistant to illnesses than regular humans are, it is also conceivable that their jumps from regions to region result in the spread of contagious disease vectors (s/a plague-carrying fleas hitching a ride on their clothing) without a sudden, easily noted rise in Deryni deaths to go along with that. But a sudden rise in humans dropping dead while Deryni either fail to get sick or get milder cases of the plague (and mostly surviving) would cause a lot of resentment from the human population nonetheless (as KK alludes to in Deryni Magic) even if the humans never manage to figure out that the sudden rise in plague outbreaks is a direct result of Portal technology.  In later centuries, scientists might eventually work that out, to the mortification of Deryni who honestly didn't know their race was responsible for causing those earlier outbreaks, and the lingering resentment of humans who don't care that the Deryni merchants of earlier times didn't actually mean to spread disease while using Portal magic to do business.
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Offline MerchantDeryni

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #19 on: September 24, 2018, 08:51:56 pm »
The risk of contagion is a factor. I was thinking of a stand alone story with a "Years of Rice and Salt" flavor. (Good book about an alternate history involving the plague).

A plus for the Deryni might be the smaller size of the loads. Ships were common carriers of rats, and the fleas that were passengers on the rats. The smaller shops and backpack size loads might reduce the chance of rat infestation and flea contact. It was a hope in my storyline anyway.

Can a vermin ward be set up on a Portal? The flash of light for some portal activations may not be an alarm, but is a magical bug zapper. :)

https://books.google.ca/books?id=21BBDgAAQBAJ&pg=PT29&lpg=PT29&dq=3+ducats+for+1+quintal+of+pepper&source=bl&ots=G5O-ayvr0B&sig=SiVesLNmBveHac9vZoCUXrnQ4rY&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj_pcX6g9XdAhWkx4MKHVu-BJMQ6AEwC3oECAYQAQ#v=onepage&q=3%20ducats%20for%201%20quintal%20of%20pepper&f=false


Found a pricing for spices. There is a Youtube video that references it, but I lost the link.
3 Ducats (3 ounces of gold) for a Qunital of pepper (125 pounds) at the source.  This sold for 22 Ducats in Lisbon. Big profits. Nutmeg was the crazy spice. 4 Ducats per Quintal was worth 300 Ducats. Not a bad income.

Merchants would risk plague, pirates, bandits, tax collectors and storms. I think the Deryni would too.


Offline revanne

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #20 on: September 25, 2018, 01:35:24 am »
I am loving your care for detail. As someone who in adult life has been very frustrated by the marmalade pudding in the beavers' house in The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe, it matters that you want to think out how does all this work.

A slightly flippant aside. I smiled at the inclusion of tax-collectors in the list of hazards only because in sermons I feel constrained to point out that Jesus singling out of tax collectors as examples of notorious sinners does not apply to harmless folk who work for HMRC ( her Majesty's revenue and customs, our equivalent of IRS.)
Let God rise up, let his enemies be scattered;
    let those who hate him flee before him.
As smoke is driven away, so drive them away;
    as wax melts before the fire,
    let the wicked perish before God.
(Psalm 68 vv1-2)

Online Laurna

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #21 on: September 25, 2018, 02:43:07 am »
I am loving your care for detail. As someone who in adult life has been very frustrated by the marmalade pudding in the beavers' house in The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe, it matters that you want to think out how does all this work.

A slightly flippant aside. I smiled at the inclusion of tax-collectors in the list of hazards only because in sermons I feel constrained to point out that Jesus singling out of tax collectors as examples of notorious sinners does not apply to harmless folk who work for HMRC ( her Majesty's revenue and customs, our equivalent of IRS.)

It is good to hear there is a distinction. I once had a good acquaintance who worked the Renaissance fair who also worked for the IRS. Adilly was a prankster and a poet, I can only mention his clothing choices on private messaging.

Offline MerchantDeryni

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #22 on: September 25, 2018, 05:04:31 am »
The level of detail gives me a reason for their actions, lots and lots of money. So I need to be able to back up the claim.  :)


The reason the 'world explorers' went off exploring was not for simple discovery. They wanted to be rich. The easiest path to the land of spices discovered would have the discoverer showered in riches. There was money in spices. Countries would be willing to go to war for the income from spices. (The spice war of 1601-1661)

Columbus was looking for India and the source of spice like saffron and nutmeg. America was an accidental discovery.

My twist on this age of discovery is that portals allow communication with the mission as long as portals are built along the route. This might make land exploration more likely. Income is faster in smaller amounts, but money starts coming in on a regular basis, not as a ship returning with 30 tonnes of cargo after a few years wait.




Offline whitelaughter

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #23 on: September 25, 2018, 05:09:21 am »
The level of detail gives me a reason for their actions, lots and lots of money. So I need to be able to back up the claim.  :)
Have you considered doing a specific roleplaying text on trade? GURPS in particular could use one.

I am loving your care for detail. As someone who in adult life has been very frustrated by the marmalade pudding in the beavers' house in The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe, it matters that you want to think out how does all this work.

ok, I'll bite. [ouch - sorry, and yes wrote that then winced] What is the problem? The bear meated coated apples in Prince Caspian, granted they don't work, you have to cook apples longer than meat, but where is the problem with a marmalade roll? As fishers the beavers have trade goods that can be exchanged with lands that aren't stuck in winter.

A slightly flippant aside. I smiled at the inclusion of tax-collectors in the list of hazards only because in sermons I feel constrained to point out that Jesus singling out of tax collectors as examples of notorious sinners does not apply to harmless folk who work for HMRC ( her Majesty's revenue and customs, our equivalent of IRS.)
Having been a tax collector, I hear you! The tax collectors of the Bible are actually tax farmers, buying the right to gouge the locals, rather than administrators of a fair tax. However, the taxes on merchants were brutal - and remember, happening at every border crossing:  IIRC that could be every few miles when travelling down the Rhine.

Offline Bynw

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #24 on: September 25, 2018, 07:24:38 am »

Can a vermin ward be set up on a Portal? The flash of light for some portal activations may not be an alarm, but is a magical bug zapper. :)


You dont want to directly ward a portal. That effectively negates it's existence. Perhaps ward the room it is in. But then still you wont be jumping out with vermin. I would think a Deryni would be able to detect their presence if he scanned for them. Especially rats. Now the fleas probably not.

Online Laurna

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #25 on: September 25, 2018, 11:55:41 am »
If you know about what you are scanning for. Know what it is and what it looks like magically, Than  yes, a Deryni can scan himself or his partner for vermin and then find magical ways of  de-lousing or de-fleeing oneself. If you don't know, you won't think about it.   So the first few merchants coming from Norway might pick up a few flees and take them home. Causing small pockets of outbreak of disease. Once the vector is figured out, which could take some time, then yes the Deryni would rid themselves of such things before and after each portal jump.  Just a little more expended energy, which might slow them down in their jump times, but in the long run, it would keep them and their families healthy.

Offline MerchantDeryni

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #26 on: September 25, 2018, 02:42:36 pm »
Well my next couple of stories do not involve plague so the cats at each merchant house way station are doing a good job.

Did KK ever make a map of the entire world?


Offline Evie

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #27 on: September 25, 2018, 02:46:46 pm »
There is a rudimentary world map (or at least their equivalent of the Old World) in the back pages of the Codex Derynianus.  But by rudimentary, I mean the countries further out from the Eleven Kingdoms are so roughly penciled into their locations as to merely suggest where they might be in relation to each other, with little to no attempt made at creating geographically believable borders. It's enough of a map to give you some idea of what other lands might exist out there well beyond the canonical Kingdoms, though.
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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #28 on: September 25, 2018, 02:59:22 pm »
If you know about what you are scanning for. Know what it is and what it looks like magically, Than  yes, a Deryni can scan himself or his partner for vermin and then find magical ways of  de-lousing or de-fleeing oneself. If you don't know, you won't think about it.   So the first few merchants coming from Norway might pick up a few flees and take them home. Causing small pockets of outbreak of disease. Once the vector is figured out, which could take some time, then yes the Deryni would rid themselves of such things before and after each portal jump.  Just a little more expended energy, which might slow them down in their jump times, but in the long run, it would keep them and their families healthy.

Now there's a modern application of Deryni magic that would be useful to parents of school-aged children and school administrations!  A Deryni Healer for a school's nurse, who, upon discovering lice on a student, just magically delouses the student and the whole school.  No more nit combing and godawful lice shampoo!  :D
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James Herriot (James Alfred "Alfie" Wight), when a human client asked him if animals have souls.  (I don't remember in which book the story originally appeared.)

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Re: Not quite fanfic
« Reply #29 on: September 25, 2018, 08:00:37 pm »
If you know about what you are scanning for. Know what it is and what it looks like magically, Than  yes, a Deryni can scan himself or his partner for vermin and then find magical ways of  de-lousing or de-fleeing oneself. If you don't know, you won't think about it.   So the first few merchants coming from Norway might pick up a few flees and take them home. Causing small pockets of outbreak of disease. Once the vector is figured out, which could take some time, then yes the Deryni would rid themselves of such things before and after each portal jump.  Just a little more expended energy, which might slow them down in their jump times, but in the long run, it would keep them and their families healthy.

Now there's a modern application of Deryni magic that would be useful to parents of school-aged children and school administrations!  A Deryni Healer for a school's nurse, who, upon discovering lice on a student, just magically delouses the student and the whole school.  No more nit combing and godawful lice shampoo!  :D

Useful. But not practical. It would take some time to conduct that delousing.

 


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