+-----------------------------------------------------------+
	|                                                           |
	| "There's no room for Christians here!" and "When we       |
	| finish with the Armenians, we'll go after the Russians!"  |
	|                                                           |
	+-----------------------------------------------------------+

DEPOSITION OF KARINE BORISOVNA MELKUMIAN [1]

Born 1963
Teacher
Boarding School No. 1

Resident at Building 2B, Apartment 21
Block 41A
Sumgait [Azerbaijan]

This is my fate: I had everything, we were a happy family, and now, at 25,
I've become a widow, I'm left to raise my three children alone; the third, not
yet two months old, was born in Yerevan. Igor and I had thought that if it was
a girl we would call her Raisa, after my mother-in-law, and if it was a boy,
we'd call him Arsen, after Igor's grandfather. I had a girl, and I, without
Igor, named her Raisa, in honor of her dead grandmother.

Our family and the Melkumians had been neighbors since 1965. Igor and I grew
up together, we were friends from childhood on. We got engaged when I was 16.
In 1981, when I was 18, we were married. Two children were born to us in
Sumgait. My daughter is now 6 years old, her name is Kristina, and my son,
Seryozha, is four and a half.

First I shall tell what happened on February 27. That day on my way home from
work I passed Lenin Square, where about 1,500 people had gathered. There were
Komsomol members there, and Pioneers [Children's organization], and there were
both Party members and non-Party people there as well. All of them were
shouting, "There's no room for Christians here!" and "When we finish with the
Armenians, we'll go after the Russians!" And some even cried Out, "Death to
the Armenians!" Absurd rumors had been circulating about town. I became
frightened. I came home, breathless, and told about everything I had seen
downtown. My family couldn't believe it. My father-in-law Sogomon Markovich
Melkumian, wasn't home, he was at an Azerbaijani wedding. By eight o'clock he
returned and had barely finished parking the car when his rear window was
smashed with a rock. He got out of the car but there was no one there. Well I
was telling him everything, too, and he said, "What, is there no longer any
government?" That same day Igor said, "Papa, something terrible is happening
in the city." And he said, "We'll stay at home, no one will drive us from our
own home."

The day passed. On February 28, that was Sunday, we didn't go out. We called
our relatives and asked them all kinds of questions, and they all said the
same thing. Sometime around evening they started smashing the car of an
Armenian from the neighboring building. Ira, my brother-in-law's wife, and I
called the police: they're wrecking a car, help. We called and called, and
nonetheless they didn't come and they didn't do anything.

On February 29, on Monday, even though there were troops in the city, we were
afraid to go to work. I called the school: I had the keys to the classroom. I
told the senior teacher that he should send someone for the keys, I wouldn't
be coming in. He agreed, and even said, "Fine, don't come in, we understand
what's going on in town, don't come in."

Before that, on the 28th, the Ambartsumian family came over. They came to my
father-in-law and said, "Uncle Sergey, they broke our windows, bad things are
happening in town." Uncle Misha Ambartsumian even said, "With my own eyes I
saw them chasing naked girls through the streets. I don't know," he said, "we
should leave town." Well on the 29th we were already trying to decide where we
should go, thinking we'd go to our dacha. We got a couple of bags together,
clothes, food, the bare essentials. And then somewhere around 4:45 the
building manager came by and said, "Uncle Sergey, the situation in town is
bad, don't go out." My father even opened up to him and said, "Maybe we'll
drive to the dacha, it'll be safer there." "No," he said, "it'll be worse
there, you'll be safer at home." He said don't be afraid, if something happens
I'll send people to save you.

After he left about 15 minutes passed and about 200 people burst into our
courtyard. All of us were at home at the time: Igor and I and our two
children, Ira and Edik and their daughter, my sister-in-law Ira, and my
mother-and father-in-law. And the Ambartsumian family, there were three of
them, Uncle Misha, Zhasmen, and their daughter Marina. Now when they started
breaking down the door I remember Edik and Igor told us, "Go in that room
and close the door. Close the door and calm the children so they won't hear
that there's anyone home." The children started crying. Suddenly Ira, my
brother-in-law's wife, suggested, "Let's run out onto the balcony." We -- the
two daughters-in-law and the children, and Zhasmen and Marina -- raced out
onto the balcony. My sister-in-law and my mother-in-law ran in and said,
"Quick, over to the other balcony, or they'll kill you all." We lived on the
second floor. We needed to cross over from our balcony to our neighbor's. At
first we couldn't manage it. The balcony looked onto the street. At that time
people were coming home from work, and many just stood there, watching. I
pleaded and begged: "Please, call someone, have someone come!" I even started
shouting. "I'll throw down the children, I'll throw them down, you catch them
and take them somewhere, so at least the children will survive." Either they
were afraid or . . . I don't know what. They looked as though they were
watching a movie. Some of them started throwing stones at us. I'll say it
again, these weren't the bandits, these were people from the other part of the
building and from our entryway, they were just regular people, passersby. A
bus even stopped. I remember a man's voice saying the Armenians were climbing
over to the other balcony. Ira, my sister-in-law, helped us get the children
over there. I was pregnant, about seven months pregnant. No, it wasn't yet
seven, it was six and a half. I climbed over too. I think Zhasmen went first;
you know, I just don't remember it all that well. Zhasmen went first, I think,
and Edik's wife Ira and I had the children, and they were all screaming and
crying. My Kristina said, "Mamma, don't throw us over the balcony, we're
afraid!" Lilia was crying, and Kristina and Seryozha were crying too. Kristina
didn't even want to climb over. She shouted, "I'm staying with Grandmother,
I'm staying with Grandma!" She loved her grandma, more than she loved me. And
my mother-in-law shouted, "Oh no, Kristina's still there, she's still there,
save Kristina, too!" Ira helped us climb over, with Kristina coming last. Ira
helped us and went back inside.

We started pounding on the neighbor's balcony door. I pounded with my fist,
Sevil, open the door, open it, please!" She didn't open it. "No, go away, go
anywhere, go, I'm not opening the door." She was our neighbor, we were
friends, we never refused her anything, ever! And apparently she thought we
were going to break the windows, and she opened the door. She opened it and
said, "Karina, Karina, go away, go anywhere, just don't stay here, they'll
kill us, too, because of you." I begged, "Please, at least take the children,
we'll leave, we'll go back." "No," she said, "you have to leave." Her sons ran
in, one had a knife. Sevil's brother, he's around 18, shouted at us: "Get out
of here, leave, I'll kill you with this knife!" I became terrified, I took the
children and went out in the entryway and went down a few stairs. I went down
and heard a loudspeaker. It was in the courtyard "The Armenians must be
killed, they've taken all the best places, all the best apartments!" One of
them said, "Let the Armenian blood flow, none of them should survive!" When I
heard that I went upstairs and started knocking on doors. No one opened their
door for me! Not on the third floor, or the fourth. I couldn't see Zhasmen any
longer. Ira came upstairs later. I even thought that they had let her stay,
that they would save her.

My head was spinning. They were killing my family, and here I was in the next
entryway with two children. Seryozha was four, and Kristina was five and a
half. They were crying, "Mamma, we're scared!" They were so frightened that I
didn't even know how to calm them, should I try to calm them or myself? It was
awful. But on the third floor a man did open his door. I asked, "Open up, let
me inside!" He opened the door slightly and said, "No!" "No" and that was it!
He said it so sternly: "No!" I went up to the fifth floor. I pounded my fists
on the door with all my might. He opened up, the man of the house, and stood
there, looking at me. I was ready to get down on my knees. I almost did get
down on my knees. "Please, I beg of you, at least take the children." He
wasn't an Azerbaijani, he was a Lezgin. I don't even know how, but he let me
inside. And when I went in, Zhasmen was already there. Two minutes hadn't
passed when Ira and Lilia came up the stairs. Lilia was crying. He didn't want
to open the door. And again I started pleading, "Please, open the door, it's
our Ira and Lilia! Open the door!" And he said, "No, I'm afraid." I said again
and again, "Please, open the door, please!" He looked at me. He looked at me
for a long time and then opened the door after all. Ira came in with Lilia. We
threw ourselves into each other's arms, crying. Then the man locked us into
the bathroom. We sat there for a long time. Through the door he told us, "Calm
the children, and calm yourselves down, too."

Calm down? This man was hiding us, but what of our family? When I was still in
our apartment I had sensed that none of us would come out of this alive. I
said, "Igor, Edik, let's say farewell." And Edik turned around and looked at
me as if to say, is that some kind of joke? All the same I thought they would
kill all of us. Igor looked at me, too . . . But it was already too late! They
started pounding on the door, Igor was standing next to the door. Before that
he had told us, "Go lock yourselves in that room and sit tight." He thought we
were in the room. But before we went out onto the balcony we went to them:
"Edik, Igor, let's say farewell." Igor didn't think we could climb over to the
other balcony. And we did get over there, and I myself can't believe we were
able to save ourselves.

Igor put on a helmet, and Edik had his coat on, and he put on a fur hat. All
the men--Igor, Edik, their father, and Misha Ambartsumian--they all stood next
to the door. They thought they would pound on it a while and leave. But from
the other side of the door they ordered in Azerbaijani: "Open the door!" We
were all silent, waiting. Someone outside the door said, "They're home,
they're in there, break down the door!" And I remember my father-in-law
whispering, "They're going to break it down now, it's coming down now . . . "

He had something in his hands, I think it was a knife: if they got in, we were
going to defend ourselves. In the hall near the door there were two metal
chair legs. From outside the door they said, "We're counting to five, open
up!" But we were all quiet, we didn't answer them. We made like no one was
home. We figured they'd leave, they'd get tired and leave. My father-in-law
had said, "It's not possible they'd come into my home. How can that be?
Everyone knows us, all of Sumgait knows our family, we are on good terms with
everyone." And indeed a day did not pass that there wasn't an Azerbaijani
guest at our table. We had a nice dacha, everyone would get together there
often, Azerbaijanis liked being with us there too. But now we had to save
ourselves, we had to flee from our own home. Ira, I remember, said, "I'm not
leaving here, my brothers and my parents are here, I'm going to fight
alongside them." That's just what she said. She picked up a knife and said,
"If they open the door and come into the apartment then I'm going to fight
alongside my family, I'm not going anywhere."

We were at Sevil's when they broke into our apartment. We heard fighting and
shouting. The noise was terrible. And when we hid upstairs on the fifth floor
at the Lezgin's apartment, you could hear everything up there, too. Even Ira's
voice. I remember her calling her mother several times. She called her for a
long time . . . I started pounding on the door in the bathroom: "Open the
door, what are they doing to Ira, who's shouting, that's Ira shouting, that's
her voice!" But the Lezgin said, "It's nothing, calm down, no, it's not in
your apartment." He was lying to me so I'd calm down. Two hours went by and
the Lezgin opened the door and said, "Karina, Igor got away, calm down. He ran
away." He saw Igor break away and run off with his own eyes. They killed him
outside, next to the building.

While we were in the bathroom I experienced every possible human terror. The
way Ira shouted! She shouted, "Save me, Mamma, save me! . . . Mamma, Mamma!"
She repeated it several times. There was a wild din. There were very many
people there, all of them shouting, all of them bellowing, howling,
whistling--you just can't imagine what was going on, what the roar was like.

Apparently, after they had killed Ira those murderers came into the entryway
where we were hiding and came upstairs, all the way up to the fifth floor. I
don't know if they were just looking for any Armenians or for us in
particular, but I think they were looking for us because when we had climbed
over the balconies someone on the street was saying that the daughters-in-law
were climbing over the balconies. And after we heard Ira we heard them coming
up the stairs in the entryway and hammering on the doors. I thought those were
our last moments, and started saying good-bye to my children, kissing them.
They were sleeping. I woke them up: "Kristina! Seryozha, wake up!" And I tell
Ira: "Ira, if something happens, we'll throw ourselves off the balcony." We
were on the fifth floor. Apparently our Lezgin neighbor had opened the door
too, because later he said, "I opened the door and told them there were no
Armenians inside." And after they all left our neighbor went out on the
balcony himself to see: they were gone.

We weren't friends with those Lezgin neighbors, we only knew each other from
the building. But the people we were friends with wouldn't even consider
hiding us.

The Lezgin let us out of the bathroom. They had a candle burning. He said,
"Karina, there're no lights on in our block." The whole block was dark, the
whole block! It's a huge block, too. The Lezgin said, "I'm afraid to keep
you until morning, I'm afraid of the neighbors, they might kill me for saving
you." I said, "What are you saying, we'll leave now. But we can't just leave
with the children in the middle of the night. Give us time to find somewhere
else to hide." He said, "Well OK, go look." I asked Ira, "Ira, do you want to
go?" Ira said, "No, I'll stay with the children, Karina." I said, "Fine, then
I'll go." Zhasmen and I went downstairs together. It was very dark. No one
was in the courtyard. It was dark, pitch black. l was afraid to go out at
after seven, Igor always met me after work and accompanied me home, I never
went out alone. And now here I was out in the middle of the night and after a
slaughter like that, too. It was probably after eleven. Later I called the
boarding school and my director answered. He said, "Karina, where are you?" I
didn't know, I was calling from a public phone outside and didn't know where I
was. I got confused and hung up the receiver. From him I only found out what
time it was, I asked him, "What time is it?" He said 11:20, I think, but I
don't really remember. So anyway Zhasmen and I went out into the courtyard. I
look and see what appears to be a person not far from our apartment. And there
was the smell of something burnt. I became horrified. I looked at the corpse
for a long time. It was either Ira or Edik. I only saw one of them, Zhasmen
grabbed my hand and squeezed it: "Hurry up, let's go . . . Hurry up, come on,
what are you turning around for?" I turned around and saw a large truck, it
must have belonged to the bandits, because they came to kill us in a truck
like that. We lived in the third entryway, and that truck was next to the
fourth. We walked quickly, holding hands. I thought, if I go to the police
then they'll put me away. I couldn't count on them. Before I reached the
police station I saw a military vehicle. We went over and I said, "Soldier, in
Block 41, I don't know if they've killed people or injured them--we need to
save them!" And he said, "Go to the police station and tell them everything."
I said, "I'm afraid to go there, I'm afraid of them." He said, "Don't be
afraid."

We went to the police and they wrote down the address, and the military
vehicle went to our building. I didn't go with them, they left me at the
police station. I gave the addresses of my mother and my brothers so that
they'd rescue them, too. I didn't know where they were or what had happened to
them.

After a while they brought my children and Ira and Lilia. First they took us
to the KGB, that was at two or three in the morning. Then around five they
took us to the City Party Committee, and there were very many people there,
very many. I was pregnant and was wearing nothing but a dress. Seryozha was
only wearing a shirt, and Kristina had a little dress on. No coat, no boots,
nothing! And we sat there for three whole days in the City Party Committee.

The Lezgin had told me that Igor escaped. And I thought that he was probably
alive. But then after two and a half days, they took us, the Armenians of
Sumgait, to Nasosny. On March 6 some people from the Central Committee came
and told us, "Karina, Ira, we need you, come with us to the City Party
Committee." My Mamma had come to Nasosny, and she had been looking for me for
six days. Mama, my brothers, and my uncle. We went to the City Party Committee
and waited there in the courtyard. I was wearing nothing but a dress, and Ira
had only a dress on as well. There was a strong wind on March 6. An hour went
by. And then one of the functionaries told us, "Karina, Ira, gather your
courage. Would you like to go to the burial?" I said, "What, did they really
kill all of them?!" He said, "Let's look." He had a long list, and he started
reading them off: Igor Melkumian, my husband, Eduard Melkumian, my brother-in-
law, Irina Melkumian, my sister-in-law, Sogomon Melkumian, my father-in-law,
and Raisa Melkumian, my mother-in-law. He read off all their names and said,
"Get in the car, let's go to the burial."

We buried our family. I couldn't believe it at the time, I couldn't conceive
of it or imagine it . . . And even now I think how shall I explain it to my
children when they're older?

My children were very attached to their father and their grandfather and
grandmother. Kristina didn't love me the way she loved her grandfather and
grandmother, they spoiled her. Kristina would always announce, "My grandma is
better than anyone!" Now, even though she is getting used to my mother, it's
difficult for her, and once she told her: "You're a bad grandmother."

I don't know why, I asked her, "Kristina, where's Papa?" and she said, "They
killed him." She knows, she understands it all. And recently I scolded
Seryozha severely for something, and he started shouting at me, "When Papa
comes I'm going to tell him everything!"

July 26, 1988
Nairi Boarding House
Near the Village of Arzakan
Hrazdan District
Armenian SSR
			- - - reference - - -

[1] _The Sumgait Tragedy; Pogroms against Armenians in Soviet Azerbaijan,
    Volume I, Eyewitness Accounts_, edited by Samuel Shahmuradian, forward by
    Yelena Bonner, 1990, published by Aristide D. Caratzas, NY, page 318-324


Hello,
	My parents are selling a 1978 22 foot Searay. it is in excellent
condition and runs great. It has a mercruiser 198 inboard/outboard engine
(it is actually a chevy 305). It is from the weekender class so it has a hard
top over the driver.
has:
	Table
	Stove
	Water Tank
	Sink
	Sleeping for 6
	much more
it is a good all around or fishing boat. If interested or for more info write tojmparkin@mtu.edu or call (313)681-4609
	Thanks,
		Jeremy
--


I need a large dog cage, the kind you use to housebreak a dog when you
are not around.  I have been adopted by a 11 month old non-housetrained
huskey.  I am in the Pittsburgh area.  My number is 412 268-8843.


Yes - Everyone seems to be in agreement that the Yankees are
finally moving in the right direction.  They should finish
over .500 this year and maybe even be in the pennent race
in August.  However, I would take back a few moves:

1.  The Jim Abbott Trade.
    I think Abbott is not only an inspirational person, but a
    great pitcher also.  He could win the Cy Young this year,
    but he won't because the right side of the Yanks infield
    isn't good enough.  So why was this not a good trade?
    JT Snow.  How many rookies have been able to step in and
    immediately have the impact that he has had so far on
    the Angels?  I know it's early, but if you've seen this kid
    hit, field or talk you can just tell that he is going to be
    a tremendous player.  The Yanks should have kept him.  What
    about Mattingly, you ask?  Well - it's great that the Yanks
    have taken care of him and remained loyal, but he's 10 years
    older than Snow and just doesn't have the same bat speed as
    before his back injury.  It's a shame, but as a Yankee fan
    who wants to see the *best* Yankee team, I'd take
    Snow over Mattingly at first.  The Yanks also gave up two
    promising propects with Snow for Abbott.  Besides, with
    Domingo Jean, Brien taylor, Wickman, Militello, and Sterling
    Hitchcock, they are just loaded with propects.  I know Abbotts
    only 26, but this was too much to give up.  I believe George
    forced this trade because he believes (and he's right) that
    Abbott will be a big hit in NY.  However, I'd like to see the
    Yankees build a baseball team, not an amusement show.

2.  Wade Boggs.
    I live in Boston and like Wade a lot.  But, his career is
    winding down and I would rather see the Yanks start to develop
    a long term solution (i.e. Hensley Muelins, Russ Davis, Velarde?).
    Besides, Wade just doesn't have any range.  What a shame about
    Charlie Hayes, huh?

3.  Spike Owen.
    See Wade Boggs.  I'd much rather see them develop Dave Silvestri
    or whoever.  Wade and Spike next to each other in the infield is
    going to raise the Yankee staff ERA 1/2 point.  And these guys
    are on the down sides of their careers.

4.  Danny Tartabull.
    Yes - he's put up some tremendous numbers and it's nice to think
    about what he could do if he were ever healthy all year.  But he
    never is.  We should expect 120 games max out of him.  Meanwhile,
    Gerald Williams is playing at Columbus and Paul O'Neil is playing
    left field!  I believe O'Neil led NL outfielders in assists
    last year - and Tartabull is a poor defensive outfielder.

What I'm basically getting at is the Yanks are moving in the right
direction but are NOT ready to win a pennent this year.  They should
(at the GM level) be planning for a 1994 or 1995 world series.  This
means getting the younger players experience in the majors NOW so they
will be ready in a year or two.

I'm afraid that all this stuff wreaks of George Steinbrenner.
Certainly, the Boggs deal was all George.  It looks like George is
planning the right mix of veterans and young players to win a world
series now.  The veterans are always available and can be added at any
time (like Boston did this year).  Develop the young players first,
then add the one or two veterans (or in the Yankees case, just keep
them).  Let's all us Yankee fans hope that George doesn't dismantle
the terrific job Stick and company have done building the Yankee
organization back into one of respect.  I'm really afraid that he will
trade whoever it takes to patch holes today (relief pitching for
example).  George must realize that the Yankees rebuilding process is
still one or two years away.  Have patience George and we will all
enjoy the future.  Fire Bucky and trade the kids and it's baseball
hell for all loyal Yankee fans for a long time!


I wrote a letter the other day to Empower America - the organization
which claims to be championing conservative issues, esp. in the wake
of the Republican defeat last fall.

Some might consider them just a an organization to create a network of
support among conservatives for some individuals in prep. for '96 run.

You'd be close to the truth.

Their two leading spokesmen are Bill Bennett, former 'Drug Czar' who heartily
supported Bush's semi-auto import ban, and wondered if it went far enough -
who helped put the big lie about 'sporting use' into the public's eye - and
Jack Kemp - who recently came out in support of semi-auto bans.

These are conservatives ?

Anyway I thought it interesting that when I ran Word Perfect's spell check
against my letter - it came up with the following corrections for 'Bennett' :

1. Banned
2. Bayonet

Needless to say, I found these choices rather amusing.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It [collectivism vs individualism] is an ancient conflict. Men have come
close to the truth, but it was destroyed each time and one civilization fell
after another. Civilization is the progress toward a society of privacy. The
savage's whole existence is public, ruled by the laws of his tribe.
Civilization is the process of setting man free from men."
    -- Ayn Rand : 'Roark's speech from the _Fountainhead_'
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't speak for my company. We hire the 'Politically Correct' to do that.


I have to agree with Ward.  The problem with your approach is they add
up what you can reasonably claim as 'spin-offs', add up what's been
spent on space, and then come back with something like, "You spent $X
billion for that?  Wouldn't it be better just to spend the money on
direct research and forget all this space stuff?  We could have got
all that stuff a *lot* cheaper that way.  Space is wasteful and
inefficient."

Then they cancel your funding and spend it studying mating rituals of
New Guinea tribesmen or something.

--
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden


can someone tell me where i could find ansi or ascii pics?

I already found the gopher ascii pics.

thanks

Richard Mancsuo


xli and xloadimage have a -goto flag.


I use a ZYGON Mind Machine as bought in the USA last year.  Although
it's no wonder cure for what ail's you.  It is however VERY good at
stopping you thinking!

Sound strange?  Well suppose you're tired and want to go to bed/sleep.
BUT your head is full of niggling problems to resolve, you lay in the
bed, and quickly they all come to the surface, churning around from one
unresolved thing to the next and then back again.  Been there, bought
the t-shirt?

I slip on the Zygon and select a soothing pattern of light & sound, and
quickly I just can't concentrate on the previous stuff. Your brain's
cache kinda get's flushed, and you start on a whole new set of stuff.

A useful addition, is the facility to feed the output of a tape player
or CD through the box, I use New Age elevator muzak to enhance the
overall effect.

DEFFO better than a pill.

Cheers Nigel


Jeez, that should do it.

Very interesting application, controlled lighting and environment, moderate
distances ... might be more interesting than my application.  Just a thought,
you could use a roof mounted IR sender, similar in operation to a TV remote
control that tells each persons coded IR pulser to send a pulse.  A Hamamatsu
detector, as was mentioned in a previous message in this thread, would give
the current position.  Store and collate this on a computer and you could
replay the movements on the screen.  Interesting!

--


Lucky they brought the situation to a prompt resolution before they had to
turn things over to the amateurs.

God help us all.
--


It seems that, to keep the peace talks going, Israel has to keep
making goodwill gesture after goodwill gesture, while Palestinian
Arabs continue to go around hunting Jews.

If the peace talks are going to have any realistic chance of success,
the Arabs are going to have to start reciprocating, especially since
they are the ones who will be getting tangible concessions in return
for giving up only intangibles.  If they keep trying to change the
already agreed upon rules, which seems to be one of their favorite
games, the Israelis are not likely to be very confident that the
intangibles they will receive at the bargaining table will be worth
the parchment they're written on.

It takes two to negotiate a peace.  It's time for the Arabs to start
doing their share.


Ugliest swing..I am not sure. I think the ugliset stance is
Jolio Franco of the Ranger. I wonder how that bat comes around in time
to hit the ball. It looks bad but hey.it get the job done.


: Unfortunately, that is the way the league is heading... You can't fight,
: so the only way to retaliate against someone is with a cheap shot when
: the ref isn't looking. Ulf has brought this to a high level... Players
: stuck in the past (like Neely) who prefer fights to cheap shots
: are at a disadvantage in the new system.

: Lets face it, A cheap shot (like high sticking) is a very effective
: method... It is easier to hide from the refs, has a better chance of
: causing injury, and you can draw people into fights that way. I don't
: like it, but that's the way the league is going.

: By the way, there was a rather good hit by Ulf in the last Penguin-Devil
: game. Managed to hit the NJ player in the face with a stick. (Must have been a
: legal hit... After all, Ulf is a clean player and is allowed to do
: things like that.)

Are there any ex NHL hockey players out there who might care to
comment on this and end this ridiculously long discussion?


I had a similar experience.  We had a written quote which had been mailed
to us from the salesman at one of these "no-haggle" Toyota dealers for
a Camry XLE w/ABS, leather, etc.  The price seemed fair, but when we
went in to take them up on their offer, they "discovered" that certain
extra cost items hadn't been included in their original written quote.
It would have totaled an extra $1100 and, in spite of the fact that we
had a written quote, they said there was nothing they could do.

Bottom line, quotes from salemen are worthless and it appears to me that
the Toyota dealers think they've got such a superior auto that they
don't have to deal.  We walked, went out and bought a new LH car
(Eagle Vision TSI) and I don't regret it one bit!


The universe, mirrored in a puddle.
Isn't it amazing how there *always* seems to be *another* bottle of bheer there?

Aleph *one* bottles of beer on the wall, Aleph *one* null bottles of beer!

	you, too, are a puddle.
	As above, so below.


From _Free Inquiry_, Winter 83/84,  the following is an
introduction to the article "Joseph Smith and the Book of
Mormon", by George D. Smith.  The introduction is written by
Paul Kurtz.

	Mormonism -- the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
	-- claims a worldwide membership 5.2 million.  It is one of
	the world's fastest growing religions, with as many as
	200,000 new converst in 1982 alone.  Because of the church's
	aggressive missionary program, covering more than one
	hundred countries, it is spreading even to third world
	countries.

	Mormonism is both puritanical in moral outlook and
	evangelical in preachment.  The church is run along strict
	authoritarian lines.  Led by a president, who allegedly
	receives revelations directly form God, and a group of
	twelve apostles who attempt to maintain orthodoxy in belief
	and practice, the church is opposed to abortion,
	pornography, sexual freedom, women's rights, and other, in
	its view, immoral influences of secular society, and it
	forbids the use of tobacco, alcohol, coffee, and tea.

	Centered in Salt Lake City, the church is extremely wealthy
	and politically powerful in Utal and many other western
	states.  Among well-know present-day Mormons are Ezra Taft
	Benson (former secretary of agriculture), the Osmond family,
	the Mariotts of the hotel empire, and a score of high-placed
	government officials.

	The Mormon church was founded in western New York in 1830 by
	Joseph Smith who claimed that by divine revelation be had
	found gold plates containing hieroglyphics buried on a hill
	and that with the help of visits from the angel Moroni he
	had been able to translate the writing into the _Book of
	Mormon_, the basis of Mormon belief.  This book, written "by
	the commandment of God," claims that the ancient Hebrews
	settled in America about 600 B.C.E. and were the ancestors
	of the American Indians.  Mormons believe that those who
	have been baptized in the "true church" will be reunited
	after death and that deceased non-Mormon family members can
	be baptized by proxy and thus join their relatives in the
	hereafter.  Because of these beliefs, Mormons have been
	considered outcasts by mainline Christian denominations and
	as heretics by religious fundamentalists.

	Joseph Smith was a controversial figure in his day -- he was
	both worshiped as a saint and denounced as a fraud.  Because
	of persecution he led his band of loyal followers from
	Palmyra, New York, westward to Ohio and then to Illinois,
	where in 1844 he was shot to death by an agry mob.  Brigham
	Young, who reportedly had as many as eighty wives, took over
	the leadership of the church and led the Mormons further
	westward, to found the new Zion in Salt Lake City.
	Following the teachings of Joseph Smith in the practice of
	polygamy was perhaps the Mormons most controversial practice
	in nineteenth-century America.

	While other religions go back many centuries --
	Muhammadanism, 1200 years; Christianity, 2000; and Judaism,
	3000 -- and attempts to examine their beginnings are
	difficult, extensive historical investigation of Mormon
	roots is possible.  Some Mormons are willing to examine this
	history objectively, bu others maintain that such scrutiny
	is dangerous to the faith.

	In the following pages, _Free Inquiry_ presents two articles
	about the Mormon church.  First, George D. Smith, a lifelong
	member of the church, provides a detailed critical
	examination of Joseph Smith and his claim the the _Book of
	Mormon_ was divinely revealed.  Second, we present a portion
	of an interview with philosopher Sterling McMurrin, also a
	Mormon since birth, who questions the treatment of the
	history of the church by Mormon authorities. -- Paul Kurtz

The article itself is super.


You should remember that in Adam's transgression, all men and women
sinned, as Paul wrote.  All of humanity cooperativley reblled against
God in Adma's sin, thus, all are subject to it, and the sin is
transmitted from generation to generation.

Andy Byler]


Well, yeah. On the other hand, for the first few years of his career he
looked like Herb Washington. Dan Gladden doesn't seem to suck defensively,
either.

Yeah, and how many of the white guys played one year into a long career?
It's actually not an uncommon phenomenon, and how long a guy hangs around
based on one good year seems like a reasonable question to explore on a
racial basis.

Hey, he plays for Lou Gorman, doesn't he? OK, so it's eight years.

Good point on Cedeno. OTOH, I haven't seen that extensive list of 10-year
Dan Gladdens, either. There really aren't that many players altogether who
hang around for 10 years even if they're reasonably good.

 Mike Jones | AIX High-End Development | mjones@donald.aix.kingston.ibm.com


I've been reading this board passively for a while now and find the
subject absolutely fascinating, especially from the point of view of
a civil rights nut like myself.  My problem is that I'm new to the field
and paragraphs like the above keep popping up.  I'm sure what Mr.
Bellovin is writing about is both fascinating and important, but I have
NO IDEA what it means.  :-)

  Anyway I'm keen to learn and will read anything I can get my hands on
that explains this stuff in lay terms (I have a decent CS background, but
not a huge amount of hyper-advanced math).  Can anyone point me to a FAQ
or a decent source of information about the guts of current cryptography and
maybe a little history as well?  I read the piece in this month's WIRED, can
anyone tell me how much I should trust the references they suggest?

  Thanks in advance,
   Steve.


The original poster wanted to know how the Big Cat looked. I was also at
the Saturday game in Montreal (Apr 17) that Rockies won 9-1. I haven't
paid much attention to Gallarraga since he left the Expos but his stance
seemed to be MUCH different. He stands more erect and very open, with his
left foot pointing to 3rd base. I'm wondering if this is a recent change
in stance for him? Andres had one glaring weakness as a hitter. He could
always be fooled by a curve ball low and away. If this is indeed a new
stance for him, maybe he is not being fooled as easily? As for his patience,

Dennis Martinez definitely did not have his good stuff. If he was grooving
pitches to Andres, you can hardly fault him for drilling them (which he did!).
Does Andres generally start hot or cold? Does it take until May for most
pitchers to have confidence in that curve ball low and away?


	Yeah! that's the guys!

	Yeah, that sounds a lot like lasertag anyway....  :-)


Hello all,
   I need to make  some torso 3D scans and would like the phone numbers of
companies in the midwest that make scans, and the numbers of companies that
make the sanners (ie Cyberware). Does anyone have an idea of how much a
single scan costs and the best format to save it in? I am not sure on what
software platform I will be using it in, probably either Softimage or
Wavefront. So I think a spline based format would be best. Please forward the
numbers to me personally as I am having problems accessing USENET lately.
Thanks in advance!


: 	This comes indirectly from Al Morgani who works in the studio
: for ESPN hockey.
[Some text deleted]
: 	ESPN is under contractual obligation to show baseball and COULD NOT
: broadcast the OT of the hockey game.  Next year, ESPN2 will be introduced so
: baseball fans can watch baseball and hockey fans can watch hockey.

I hadn't heard about this new ESPN2. When is this new network
supposed to start? Sounds great to me! (as long as my cable co.
offers it)


Where can I buy blinking LEDs besides radio shack?

  * Does anyone sell blinking LEDs with variable flash rate? (by voltage
    I guess) If so, what hertz (pulse) rate are they adjustable or set to?

     I'd like blinking LEDs that can be set for approx 5 hz, 10 hz,
     15 hz, or 20 hz. Something like that... I'm interested in what's
     out there for flash rates. I like the idea of LEDs with flasher
     circuits already in them. I hate soldering ICs in general. Guess I
     don't have a hell of a lot of patience.

      Thanks,


Edgar Pearlstein asks (Fri 7 May 1993) whether the Supreme Court, or
any other government authority, has attempted a legal definition of
religion.

The Universal Military Training and Service Act of 1958 exempted
from the draft those whose "religious training and belief" was
opposed to participation in war in any form. It defined "R T & B" as
"an individual's belief in a relation to a Supreme Being involving
duties superior to those arising from any human relation, but [not
including] essentially political, sociological, or philosophical
views or a merely personal moral code."

In the 1965 case of UNITED STATES V. SEEGER, the Supreme Court
broadened the definition so as not to restrict it to explicit

   We have concluded that Congress, in using the expression "Supreme
   Being" rather than the designation "God," .... the test of belief
   "in a relation to a Superme Being" is whether a given belief that
   is sincere and meaningful occupies a place in the life of its
   possessor parallel to that filled by the orthodox belief in God
   of one who clearly qualifies for the exemption. Where such
   beliefs have parallel positions in the lives of their respective
   holders we cannot say that one is "in a relation to a Supreme
   Being" and the other is not...."

My immediate reference is THE FIRST FREEDOM, by Nat Hentoff,
(Delacorte 1980, Dell 1981).


A bunch of things i have too many of :
chips :
type	    new/pull  price      desc
AD1856	       N	$3.50	16 bit serial D/A converter smt like PCM56
TMS32020GBL  P	$12.00	TI DSP chip
MC68020RC25  P  	$12.00	Make your own Mac ????
Z08613/08STD  N	$12.00	Piggyback emulator for Z8 family
D77P20	       P	$12.00	NEC's EPROM version DSP chip
MK38P73	       P	$25.00	you gotta really want 'em !
LM213	       N	$30.00 	Hitachi 256*64 bitmapped display
lots of others including 22V10, C22V10, 16L8,16R8
other stuff includes :
Cipher tape drives				$10.00
Data I/O device programmer	$60.00	dont go !
Apple Laserwriter				$550.00	a beauty-only 8k page
Mac 800k int drives			$40.00


Poor 'Poly'. I see you're preparing the groundwork for yet another
retreat from your 'Arromdian-ASALA/SDPA/ARF' claims.

Just love it. If that does ever happen, look out the window and see
if there is a non-fascist/Nazi x-Soviet Armenian Government in the East.
By the way, your ignorance on the Armenian genocide of 2.5 million Muslim
people is hardly characteristic of most 'Arromdians'.

Source: K. S. Papazian, "Patriotism Perverted," Baikar Press, Boston, 1934.

pp. 17-18.

"It seems that terrorism against their own co-nationals has been a prominent
 part of the revolutionary activities of the Dashnag leaders of the Caucasus.
 Organized to fight the Turks, these chieftains have been more successful
 in their fight against their Armenian opponents in Turkey, and the Caucasus,
 very often defenseless and innocent."

p. 38.

"The fact remains, however, that the leaders of the Turkish Armenian section
 of the Dashnagtzoutune did not carry out their promise of loyalty to the
 Turkish cause when the Turks entered the war...and a call was sent for
 Armenian volunteers to fight the Turks on the Caucasian front."

p. 38.

"Thousands of Armenians from all over the world, flocked to the standards of
 such famous fighters as Antranik, Kery, Dro, etc. The Armenian volunteer
 regiments rendered valuable service to the Russian Army in the years of
 1914-15-16."

Got a map? Got a minute?

Source #1: McCarthy, J., "Muslims and Minorities, The Population of Ottoman
           Anatolia and the End of the Empire," New York University Press,
           New York, 1983, pp. 133-144.

Source #2: Hovannisian, Richard G., "Armenia on the Road to Independence,
           1918. University of California Press (Berkeley and Los Angeles),
           1967, p. 13.

Now where is your non-existent list of scholars and publicly available
scholarly sources; here is mine. What an 'Arromdian'...

 SOME OF THE REFERENCES FROM EMINENT AUTHORS IN THE FIELD OF MIDDLE-EASTERN
 HISTORY AND EYEWITNESSES OF THE ARMENIAN GENOCIDE OF 2.5 MILLION MUSLIMS

1. "The Armenian Revolutionary Movement" by Louise Nalbandian,
   University of California Press, Berkeley, Los Angeles, 1975

2. "Diplomacy of Imperialism 1890-1902" by William I. Lenger, Professor
   of History, Harward University, Boston, Alfred A. Knopt, New York, 1951

3. "Turkey in Europe" by Sir Charles Elliot,
   Edward & Arnold, London, 1900

4. "The Chatnam House Version and Other Middle-Eastern Studies" by
   Elie Kedouri, Praeger Publishers, New York, Washington, 1972

5. "The Rising Crescent" by Ernest Jackh,
   Farrar & Reinhart, Inc., New York & Toronto, 1944

6. "Spiritual and Political Evolutions in Islam" by Felix Valyi,
   Mogan, Paul, Trench & Truebner & Co., London, 1925

7. "The Struggle for Power in Moslem Asia" by E. Alexander Powell,
   The Century Co., New York, London, 1924

8. "Struggle for Transcaucasia" by Feruz Kazemzadeh,
   Yale University Press, New Haven, Conn., 1951

9. "History of the Ottoman Empire and Modern Turkey" (2 volumes) by
   Stanford J. Shaw, Cambridge University Press, Cambridge, New York,
   Melbourne, 1977

10."The Western Question in Greece and Turkey" by Arnold J. Toynbee,
   Constable & Co., Ltd., London, Bombay & Sydney, 1922

11."The Caliph's Last Heritage" by Sir Mark Sykes,
   Macmillan & Co., London, 1915

12."Men Are Like That" by Leonard A. Hartill,
   Bobbs Co., Indianapolis, 1928

13."Adventures in the Near East, 1918-22" by A. Rawlinson,
   Dodd, Meade & Co., 1925

14."World Alive, A Personal Story" by Robert Dunn,
   Crown Publishers, Inc., New York, 1952

15."From Sardarapat to Serves and Lousanne" by Avetis Aharonian,
   The Armenian Review Magazine, Volume 15 (Fall 1962) through 17
   (Spring 1964)

16."Armenia on the Road to Independence" by Richard G. Hovanessian,
   University of California Press, Berkeley, California, 1967

17."The Rebirth of Turkey" by Clair Price,
   Thomas Seltzer, New York, 1923

18."Caucasian Battlefields" by W. B. Allen & Paul Muratoff,
   Cambridge, 1953

19."Partition of Turkey" by Harry N. Howard,
   H. Fertig, New York, 1966

20."The King-Crane Commission" by Harry N. Howard,
   Beirut, 1963

21."United States Policy and Partition of Turkey" by Laurence Evans,
   John Hopkins University Press, Baltimore, 1965

22."British Documents Related to Turkish War of Independence" by Gothard
   Jaeschke

1. Neside Kerem Demir, "Bir Sehid Anasina Tarihin Soyledikleri:
   Turkiye'nin Ermeni Meselesi," Hulbe Basim ve Yayin T.A.S.,
   Ankara, 1982. (Ingilizce Birinci Baski: 1980, "The Armenian
   Question in Turkey")

2. Veysel Eroglu, "Ermeni Mezalimi," Sebil Yayinevi, Istanbul, 1978.

3. A. Alper Gazigiray, "Osmanlilardan Gunumuze Kadar Vesikalarla Ermeni
   Teroru'nun Kaynaklari," Gozen Kitabevi, Istanbul, 1982.

4. Dr. Kirzioglu M. Fahrettin, "Kars Ili ve Cevresinde Ermeni Mezalimi,"
   Kardes Matbaasi, Ankara, 1970.

T.C. Basbakanlik Osmanli Arsivi, Babiali, Istanbul:

a) Yildiz Esas Evraki
b) Yildiz Perakende
c) Irade Defterleri
d) Cemaat-i Gayr-i Muslime Defterleri
e) Meclisi Vukela Mazbatalari
f) Dahiliye Nezareti, Kalem-i Mahsus Dosyalari
g) Dahiliye Nezareti, Sifre Defterleri
h) Babiali Evrak Odasi: Siyasi Kartonlar
i) Babiali Evrak Odasi: Muhimme Kartonlari

T.C. Disisleri Bakanligi, Hazine-i Evrak, Defterdarlik

a) Harb-i Umumi
b) Muteferrik Kartonlar

British Archives:

a) Parliamentary Papers (Hansard): Commons/Lords
b) Foreign Office: Confidential Print: Various Collections
c) Foreign Office: 424/239-253: Turkey: Correspondence - Annual Reports
d) Foreign Office: 608
e) Foreign Office: 371, Political Intelligence: General Correspondence
f) Foreign Office: 800/240, Ryan Papers
g) Foreign Office: 800/151, Curzon Papers
h) Foreign Office: 839: The Eastern Conference: Lausanne. 53 files

India Office Records and Library, Blackfriars Road, London.

a) L/Political and Security/10/851-855 (five boxes), "Turkey: Treaty of
   Peace: 1918-1923"
b) L/P & S/10/1031, "Near East: Turkey and Greece: Lausanne Conference,
   1921-1923"
c) L/P & S/11/154
d) L/P & S/11/1031

French Archives

Archives du ministere des Affaires entrangeres, Quai d'Orsay, Paris.

a) Documents Diplomatiques: Affaires Armeniens: 1895-1914 Collections
b) Guerre: 1914-1918: Turquie: Legion d'Orient.
c) Levant, 1918-1929: Armenie.

Official Publications, Published Documents, Diplomatic Correspondence,
Agreements, Minutes and Others

A. Turkey (The Ottoman Empire and The Republic of Turkey)

Akarli, E. (ed.); "Belgelerle Tanzimat," (istanbul, 1978).
(Gn. Kur., ATASE); "Askeri Tarih Belgeleri Dergisi," V. XXXI (81),
(Dec. 1982).
----; "Askeri Tarih Belgeleri Dergisi," V. XXXII (83),
(Dec. 1983).
Hocaoglu, M. (ed.); "Ittihad-i Anasir-i Osmaniye Heyeti Nizamnamesi,"
(Istanbul, 1912).
Meray, S. L. (trans./ed.) "Lozan Baris Konferansi: Tutanaklar-Belgeler,"
(Ankara, 1978), 2 vols.
Meray, S. L./O. Olcay (ed.); "Osmanli Imparatorlugu'nun Cokus Belgeleri;
Mondros Birakismasi, Sevr Andlasmasi, Ilgili Belgeler," (Ankara, 1977).
(Osmanli Devleti, Dahiliye Nezareti); "Aspirations et Agissements
Revolutionnaires des Comites Armeniens avant et apres la proclamation
de la Constitution Ottomane," (Istanbul, 1917).
----; "Ermeni Komitelerinin Amal ve Hareket-i Ihtilaliyesi: Ilan-i
Mesrutiyetten Evvel ve Sonra," (Istanbul, 1916).
----; "Idare-i Umumiye ve Vilayet Kanunu," (Istanbul, 1913).
----; "Muharrerat-i Umumiye Mecmuasi, V. I (Istanbul, 1914).
----; "Muharrerat-i Umumiye Mecmuasi, V. II (Istanbul, 1915).
----; "Muharrerat-i Umumiye Mecmuasi, V. III (Istanbul, 1916).
----; "Muharrerat-i Umumiye Mecmuasi, V. IV (Istanbul, 1917).
(Osmanli Devleti, Hariciye Nezareti); "Imtiyazat-i Ecnebiyye'nin
Lagvindan Dolayi Memurine Teblig Olunacak Talimatname," (Istanbul, 1915).
(Osmanli Devleti, Harbiye Nezareti); "Islam Ahalinin Ducar Olduklari
Mezalim Hakkinda Vesaike Mustenid Malumat," (Istanbul, 1919).
----; (IV. Ordu) "Aliye Divan-i Harbi Orfisinde Tedkik Olunan Mesele-yi
Siyasiye Hakkinda Izahat," (Istanbul, 1916).
Turkozu, H. K. (ed.); "Osmanli ve Sovyet Belgeleriyle Ermeni Mezalimi,"
(Ankara, 1982).
----; "Turkiye Buyuk Millet Meclisi Gizli Celse Zabitlari," (Ankara, 1985),
4 vols.

Russia

Adamof, E. E. (ed.); "Sovyet Devlet Arsivi Belgeleriyle Anadolu'nun
Taksimi Plani," (tran. H. Rahmi, ed. H. Mutlucag), (Istanbul, 1972).

Altinay, A. R.; "Iki Komite - Iki Kital," (Istanbul, 1919).
----; "Kafkas Yollarinda Hatiralar ve Tahassusler," (Istanbul, 1919).
----; "Turkiye'de Katolik Propagandasi," Turk tarihi Encumeni Mecmuasi,
V. XIV/82-5 (Sept. 1924).
Asaf Muammer; "Harb ve Mesulleri," (Istanbul, 1918).
Akboy, C.; "Birinci Dunya Harbinde Turk Harbi, V. I: Osmanli Imparatorlugu'nun
Siyasi ve Askeri Hazirliklari ve Harbe Girisi," (Gn. Kur., Ankara, 1970).
Akgun, S.; "General Harbord'un Anadolu Gezisi ve (Ermeni Meselesi'ne Dair)
Raporu: Kurtulus Savasi Baslangicinda," (Istanbul, 1981).
Akin, I.; "Turk Devrim Tarihi," (Istanbul, 1983).
Aksin, S.; "Jon Turkler ve Ittihad ve Terakki," (Istanbul, 1976).
Basar, Z. (ed.);"Ermenilerden Gorduklerimiz," (Ankara, 1974).
----; "Ermeniler Hakkinda Makaleler - Derlemeler," (Ankara, 1978).
Belen, F.; "Birinci Dunya Harbinde Turk Harbi," (Ankara, 1964).
Deliorman, A.; "Turklere Karsi Ermeni Komitecileri," (Istanbul, 1980).
Ege, N. N. (ed.); "Prens Sabahaddin: Hayati ve Ilmi Mudafaalari,"
(Istanbul, 1977).
Ercikan, A.; "Ermenilerin Bizans ve Osmanli Imparatorluklarindaki Rolleri,"
(Ankara, 1949).
Gurun, K.; 'Ermeni Sorunu yahut bir sorun nasil yaratilir?', "Turk Tarihinde
Ermeniler Sempozyumu," (Izmir, 1983).
Hocaoglu, M.; "Arsiv Vesikalariyla Tarihte Ermeni Mezalimi ve Ermeniler,"
(Istanbul, 1976).
Karal, E. S.; "Osmanli Tarihi," V. V (1983, 4th ed.); V. VI (1976, 2nd ed.);
V. VII (1977, 2nd ed.); V. VIII (1983, 2nd ed.) Ankara.
Kurat, Y. T.; "Osmanli Imparatorlugu'nun Paylasilmasi," (Ankara, 1976).
Orel, S./S. Yuca; "Ermenilerce Talat Pasa'ya Atfedilen Telgraflarin
Icyuzu," (Ankara, 1983). [Also in English translation.]
Ahmad, F.; "The Young Turks: The Committee of Union and Progress in
Turkish Politics," (Oxford, 1969).

During the First World War and the ensuing years - 1914-1920,
the Armenian Dictatorship through a premeditated and systematic
genocide, tried to complete its centuries-old policy of
annihilation against the Turks and Kurds by savagely murdering
2.5 million Muslims and deporting the rest from their 1,000 year
homeland.

The attempt at genocide is justly regarded as the first instance
of Genocide in the 20th Century acted upon an entire people.
This event is incontrovertibly proven by historians, government
and international political leaders, such as U.S. Ambassador Mark
Bristol, William Langer, Ambassador Layard, James Barton, Stanford
Shaw, Arthur Chester, John Dewey, Robert Dunn, Papazian, Nalbandian,
Ohanus Appressian, Jorge Blanco Villalta, General Nikolayef, General
Bolkovitinof, General Prjevalski, General Odiselidze, Meguerditche,
Kazimir, Motayef, Twerdokhlebof, General Hamelin, Rawlinson, Avetis
Aharonian, Dr. Stephan Eshnanie, Varandian, General Bronsart, Arfa,
Dr. Hamlin, Boghos Nubar, Sarkis Atamian, Katchaznouni, Rachel
Bortnick, Halide Edip, McCarthy, W. B. Allen, Paul Muratoff and many
others.

J. C. Hurewitz, Professor of Government Emeritus, Former Director of
the Middle East Institute (1971-1984), Columbia University.

Bernard Lewis, Cleveland E. Dodge Professor of Near Eastern History,
Princeton University.

Halil Inalcik, University Professor of Ottoman History & Member of
the American Academy of Arts & Sciences, University of Chicago.

Peter Golden, Professor of History, Rutgers University, Newark.

Stanford Shaw, Professor of History, University of California at
Los Angeles.

Thomas Naff, Professor of History & Director, Middle East Research
Institute, University of Pennsylvania.

Ronald Jennings, Associate Professor of History & Asian Studies,
University of Illinois.

Howard Reed, Professor of History, University of Connecticut.

Dankwart Rustow, Distinguished University Professor of Political
Science, City University Graduate School, New York.

John Woods, Associate Professor of Middle Eastern History,
University of Chicago.

John Masson Smith, Jr., Professor of History, University of
California at Berkeley.

Alan Fisher, Professor of History, Michigan State University.

Avigdor Levy, Professor of History, Brandeis University.

Andreas G. E. Bodrogligetti, Professor of History, University of California
at Los Angeles.

Kathleen Burrill, Associate Professor of Turkish Studies, Columbia University.

Roderic Davison, Professor of History, George Washington University.

Walter Denny, Professor of History, University of Massachusetts.

Caesar Farah, Professor of History, University of Minnesota.

Tom Goodrich, Professor of History, Indiana University of Pennsylvania.

Tibor Halasi-Kun, Professor Emeritus of Turkish Studies, Columbia University.

Justin McCarthy, Professor of History, University of Louisville.

Jon Mandaville, Professor of History, Portland State University (Oregon).

Robert Olson, Professor of History, University of Kentucky.

Madeline Zilfi, Professor of History, University of Maryland.

James Stewart-Robinson, Professor of Turkish Studies, University of Michigan.

.......so the list goes on and on and on.....

Serdar Argic


Many cars sold here in Finland are *small* and *cheap* cars (at least when
compared to other cars --- note that we have over 120 % car tax).

And you couldn't expect a good auto mated to a 1.3 L engine?


OK.  And you regularly ride your bike to within 2% of it's maximum capability?
(Note any idiot can go flat out on a bike - most of them do.)

Anyway, efficient at what?  A shaft drive is a much more efficient solid (erect) lump
of metal than a floppy (flaccid, unsatisfying) chain.


I recall that Ehman 'died'...

Can anyone suggest what the problem is when the picture jumps
about an inch any direction?

Two page monchrome monitor connected to Newlife accelerator and
video board in an SE... At the end of the work day, several hours
with power on, the picture will occasionally jitter a couple of times
and then remain calm for a few minutes. Then it does more shaking...

The environment around the computer appears to be stable. Nothing
newly introduced near the computer.

Any ideas? Please e-mail to carsona@sfu.ca or reply here.

Also... Has anyone used Ehman two page with Powerbook video? What
was required? Just a cable adapter?

Thanks for any help!

Dale
carsona@sfu.ca


If some kind person has access to a mathematical package such as Mathematica,
Maple,... I would like to ask you for the solution to the following problem.
I sometimes have algebra problems like this where I would like a simplified
symbolic solution. Is there a FTP-able package out there that can handle such
beasts?

    I would like to solve the following ray - Bezier patch intersection
    for the scalar constant t in:

        P                    + t * V                =  Q(u,w)
         (origin point in 3D)       (dir vector 3D)

    in terms of only:

          P            V            P                     and various scalars
           (origin) ,   (dir 3D) ,   (i,j) 0 <= i,j <= 3

    where:

                            T
    Q(u,w) = [U] [N] [B] [M]  [W]

               n  n-1  n-2   n-3
      [U] = [ u  u    u     u ....     u  1 ]      ( 0.0 <= u <= 1.0 )
               3  2
          = [ u  u  u 1 ]    ( in my particular case )

               n  n-1  n-2   n-3             T
      [W] = [ w  w    w     w ....     w  1 ]      ( 0.0 <= w <= 1.0 )

               3  2      T
          = [ w  w  w 1 ]    ( in my particular case )

                   T
      [ N ] = [ M ]   =  | -1  3 -3  1 |     ( for my particular case )
                         |  3 -6  3  0 |
                         | -3  3  0  0 |
                         |  1  0  0  0 |

      [ B ] =  | P       P       P       P      | (control points in 3D space)
               |  (0,0)   (0,1)   (0,2)   (0,3) |
               |                                |
               | P       P       P       P      |
               |  (1,0)   (1,1)   (1,2)   (1,3) |
               |                                |
               | P       P       P       P      |
               |  (2,0)   (2,1)   (2,2)   (2,3) |
               |                                |
               | P       P       P       P      |
               |  (3,0)   (3,1)   (3,2)   (3,3) |

                                        Thanx,


What is the actual clock speed of a Centris 610?
20 MHZ or 25 MHZ

Thanks in advance...


There is one point I'd like to make, that most people seem to have forgotten.
That is that one of the underlining principles in the Constitution is a DISTRUST
of governmental authority and control. All those "checks & balances" is because
they realize that you should distrust those in power. What everyone seems to have
forgotten as well is the original reason that the Bill of Rights guaranteed the
right to bear arms. It's inclusion was not to allow you to protect yourself
against other citizens, but to prevent the government from taking away your only
means of protecting yourself from an armed and aggressive government. Its hard to
oppress your citizenry when its armed against you.

I am not a fanatic, I'm a retired Naval officer. Because I have spent so much
time defending it, perhaps I understand its "purpose" as well as its "plan".


I can't believe sh*t like this gets any attention in this group during
the playoffs.

Ali,you're a blabbering moron. At least you could've waited 'till
the end of the playoffs to start your dumb letter campaign.


Sounds to me like you'd want a star for the ground plane.


  You've got it. What you regard as a right, someone else will regard
as a privilege. Followups to some generic ethics and morality
newsgroup ....


Hi

Does anyone know of a direct way to print an image of an .xbm file.

Please reply directly and I'll post a summary.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Any opinion presented here is my own, and does not reflect the policy
of my employer, NASA, or the Ames Research Center.

Roger Smith
Sterling Software at
NASA-Ames Research Center
rsmith@proteus.arc.nasa.gov


	When did the BATF say this? Everything I've seen from the BATF,
	from the official version to the dissident statements of BATF
	officers who conducted the raid claims that the Davidians were
	shooting at the agents long before they were within grenade
	range.

	Also, if the warrant is sealed, how do we know it was a 'no-knock'?

                  _____  _____
                  \\\\\\/ ___/___________________
  Mitchell S Todd  \\\\/ /                 _____/__________________________
________________    \\/ / mst4298@zeus._____/.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'_'_'_/
\_____        \__    / / tamu.edu  _____/.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'.'_'_/
    \__________\__  / /        _____/_'_'_'_'_'_'_'_'_'_'_'_'_'_'_/
                \_ / /__________/
                 \/____/\\\\\\
 			 \\\\\\


:
: It would seem that a society with a "failed" government would be an ideal
: setting for libertarian ideals to be implemented.  Now why do you suppose
: that never seems to occur?...

Advances in freedom have been made in the past.  The "divine right of
king" concept was questioned at one time and may have used the same
argument, that it hadn't come about before.  But our ancestors had the
courage to throw off the old system that said that one man ruling many
was necessary to have a decent, wholesome society.  In the 1800s the
concept of slavery was questioned.  Our ancestors had the courage to
question a practice that had existed for thousands of years.  Was
the idea that one man owning another necessary to have a decent,
wholesome society?  Now libertarians question the necessity of
majoritarianism.  Is it necessary that many people rule over many
others to have a decent, wholesome society?


Hello there,

I am looking for Sim City for PC (new/used). Please make your offer to
cchu@udel.edu. Thanks !


How can you be sure the two visitors were really government agents?
:-)

--John


I was reading a review of the Centris 610 in this
months MacWorld and the reviewer said that for
$4 you could make an adjustment on the clock speed
of the chip and change it from 20mhz to 25mhz.  I
haven't heard of this before, and I don't think that
this is the 040 chip replacement (with fpu) that I have
seen so much talk about.  Anyone have any ideas?
cwera@du.edu


The AIAA San Gabriel Valley Section is sponsoring the following lecture
on Mars exploration at the Jet Propulsion Lab.  Admission is free and open to
the public.

                           The Next Frontier:
                    The Challenge of Mars Exploration

                      DATE:     May 6, 1993
                      TIME:     6:00PM - 8:30 PM
                      LOCATION: Von Karman Auditorium
                                Jet Propulsion Lab
                                4800 Oak Grove Drive
                                Pasadena, California

     The following five speakers will be featured:

              A Science Fiction Perspective
              Tom McDonaugh
              Science Fiction Writer

               Mars Observer
               Dr. Arden Albee
               Project Scientist, Mars Observer - JPL

               Mars '94
               Dr. Arthur L. Lane
               Instrument Manager, Mars '94 - JPL

               Mars Environmental Survey (MESUR)
               Richard Cook
               Mission Designer - JPL

               Manned Mission to Mars
               Dr. Robert Zubrin
               Senior Engineer, Martin Marietta Astronautics


: Now for those who have read this far -

: 	Why did it rev at idle like that?  Is water in the fuel an
: acceptable reaason or were they having me on?

Sound like the pilot circuit was say lean/clogged.  I don't think
water would cause a problem like this, but?

: 	Apparently the oil pump is doing its job, and there was plenty
: of oil.  Why did it seize?

See above.  Were you by chance coasting when it stuck?  On a two stroke
you only have (substantial) lubrication when you are giving the bike gas.
If it was lean on the pilot, that's why it stuck.

: Oh, BTW - THe motor had been rebuilt just before I left Adelaide, so had
: done about 1600 miles when it blew.  It was rebuilt because it had been
: seized at some time before we got it, and it looked like that seizure
: had happened at low mileage, because there were still hone marks in the
: bore.

: The rebuild we did consisted of a total tear down, new piston, rings,
: small end bearing, and new gearbox bearings.  Big end and rod judged
: OK.

: Any ideas folks?

You mentioned an aftermarket carb?  (I deleted the text)  Looks like
(to me) that's where your problem is.

:      Zebee Johnstone  DoD #605   | You don't own an Italian motorcycle


Hi,

Does anyone know where I can get the developer notes for the new Mac models
(like IIvx, LC III, Centris)?

Thank's for any information.  Please reply by email.


"The Forever War", one of my favorite SciFi books, had a passage devoted to
breathing fluids. The idea was to protect people from the high accelerations
required for interstellar travel by emersing the passengers in dry-cleaning
fluid saturated with oxygen. Plenty of very imaginative ideas is this book.
I would certainly recommend it (won the Hugo and the Nebula awards).


I would like to sell my camcorder. I havent used it much and I need the
money.

Panasonic PV-17 VHS-C Palmcorder

-High Speed Shutter
-Flying Erasr Head
-8:1 Power Zoom
-Digital Autp Tracking
-Audio/Video Dubbing
-Auto Tracking
-Digital Automatic Focus
-Book Mark Search
-Record Review
-Automatic White Balance
-CCD Image Sensor
-HQ System

Includes:
-Rechargeable battery
-Battery charger
-VHS PlayPak adapter
-4 Compact video cassettes
-All original docs, cables, box, etc.

I got it new in Sept. '92 and used it a total of about 20-25 times.
The battery has been charged less than 5 times. This thing is in
brand-new condition.

I am asking $550. Make me an offer.


I heard the other day that Rush has gotten together with Tammy Faye Baker.
  They were crawling in bed the other night and Rush's feet brushed up against
  Tammy's legs.  "God! your feet are cold" she said.  Rush looked back at here
  and said, "Tammy honey, I told you when we're alone you can just call me
  Rush."

  Ba dump Bump!  pishhhhh


Found this in soc.culture.pakistan
Might be of interest..... am posting it without the permission of the original poster.
Hope he/she doesnt mind.

By Lance Gay, Scripps-Howard News Service

SARAJEVO, Bosnia-Herzegovina -- In this land of historic hatreds, a tiny
Jewish community is braving Serbian shells to repay a 50-year-old debt to
Muslims who saved Jews from the Holocaust.

Ivica Ceresnjes, president of the Jewish Community of Sarajevo, says he
and about 1,000 other Jews chose to remain in Sarajevo, rather than leave
for Israel, to keep a feeding center in the medieval old town district
running.

Ceresnjes said that was partly in gratitude to the Muslims who hid Jews during
the Nazi occupation and partly to keep intact the centuries-old presence of
Jews living in Sarajevo.

``Some with guns are defending Bosnia, but I fight in Bosnia by keeping
people alive,'' Ceresnjes said.

As a student of Balkan history, Ceresnjes said he saw this war coming and
had ready plans to evacuate children and the elderly. A year before the war
erupted here last April, Ceresnjes said the Jewish center began
stockpiling supplies, ensuring everyone had passports and arranging for
places in Israel and Europe for the evacuees.

They were so well prepared, he said, that only five days after the
shooting began the first plane left. Of about 2,000 Jews in Bosnia-
Herzegovina, he estimates half have left. Many of those who stayed behind
work in Sarajevo's downtown synagogue, which has been turned into a
wartime feeding center that has so far given away 380,000 meals.

The center, which has been shelled several times along with most of
Sarajevo, also runs a radio station, mail center and distributes food
packages sent by Jewish organizations around the world.

While Muslims and Jews are fighting each other in the Mideast, Jews here
say there's a long tradition of cooperation, inter-marriage and
tolerance between the two communities in Sarajevo that goes back to
centuries of Turkish occupation.

Sarajevo's Jews trace their ancestry back to their expulsion from Roman
Catholic Spain in 1492. The community numbered more than 14,000 before
World War II. But only 10% survived the Holocaust -- which was carried out
by the pro-Nazi Croatian Ustache in Yugoslavia. Many of the survivors were
hidden by Muslim families in Mostar.

--
Sharon Machlis Gartenberg
Framingham, MA  USA
e-mail: sharon@world.std.com

----------------------------------------
Zafar.


Or just use the URT tool: rastorle.

Yes, both it and the newer xli can.


	Yeah, maybe that is more likely.  But from the Mariners-Tigers
series, it seems like every time there are base runners, the pitchers
seem to purposely pitch around him or give him a free pass.  The
funny thing was that Griffey was struggling up until the last game of the
four game series if I remember correctly.

- Chung Yang


If anyone would like to get rid of their SegaCD for software please get
in touch. Ive got loads of SNES and Genesis/MegaDrive software Id like
to trade for a SegaCD or even partially (i.e. Ill also pay some $).

Let me know if you are interested.

Cheers
Jonathan


used
after
Nanao's so I
contrast is
SS2 color
as good,
running across.
as well
way the 5FG

I believe PC mag said 5FGE can't do 1280x1024.

tso@cephalo.neusc.bcm.tmc.edu


No one has mentioned violence other than you, Mr. Han. I believe you
are imagining things.

--
Perry Metzger		pmetzger@shearson.com


    >>You should face the facts. Love Canal was not, and is not, an
    >>environmental disaster, nor even a problem.
    >>
    >>Nor is Times Beach and TMI and acid rain killing trees and
    >>....
    >>
    >Not a problem? Would you move to Three Mile Island? I would
    >imagine there is some cheap property available!

No, because I don't like the weather back East. However, it would bother me
not one bit to live in an equivalent area here. By the way, do you KNOW what
the extra exposure to radiation from TMI was?

    >The naturally occurring catastrophic events [disasters] that
    >destroy property (ie: hurricanes, tornados, earthquakes) do
    >not usually leave toxic wastes that prevent people from
    >re-building their lives there. The man-made disasters (oil
    >spills, toxic dumping, radioactive waste dispersions) cause
    >death and make an area unliveable far beyond the initial
    >event.

O.K., in the U.S., tell me about some of these deaths and some of these
unliveable areas. Oh, and if you manage to find some of these unliveable
areas, tell me what percentage of the total US land area they are.
(Hint - the total waste produced by all nuclear reactors in the US can be
safely stored in the area of three footbal fields.)

--
There are actually people that STILL believe Love Canal was some kind of
environmental disaster. Weird, eh?


ctwomey@vms.eurokom.ie (Colum Twomey) comments:

Casady & Greene seems to be notoriously slow about responding, as
I've heard from others who have contacted them.  They may not reply
via fax, but via snail mail.  Give them time, or contact them again.

Rhia


My son is considering the purchase of a 71 MGB, which has been substantially
restored.  The odometer has rolled over, but we can't be sure of the actual
mileage.  The engine and drive train apparently weren't touched in the
restoration, except for a new carb and a few hoses.  He plans to do vacuum and
compression checks to see what they might tell us about the engine.  The body
and undercarriage have no visible rust, the interior is new, as are tires,
front brakes (not sure about the back), battery, bumpers and other misc parts.
The paint is checked in a few places, and scuffed here and there, allegedly by
a wind-blown car cover.  It seemed to handle OK, except for soft front shocks.
Questions:

Are there problem areas common to MGBs we should check out?

The brakes seem soft and rather ineffective; what should we expect in the way
of braking action?

It seemed to be "doggy" when accelerating from a stop.  What should we expect
it to do, given the 4-cylinder engine?

The top is in place, but will not reach a number of the snaps.  The weather
was cold.  Should the vinyl stretch and fit when it warms up, or is it forever
shrunk?

Is it normal for the wire wheels to be painted, or are they usually chromed?

Given this rather limited description, what would be a reasonable price?

Gee, this turned out to be a little long--sorry.  While my brother once owned
an XK120 Jag (what a car!) we're obviously not into sports cars.  Any help with
these questions, or suggestions on other things to investigate would surely be
appreciated.


They are and they have.

David


    Yes.  There are many methods of rendering, raytracing is one of them.
You didn't say what you mean by rendering, so I won't guess.  Methods of
rendering include:

        o  Pencil and graph paper, doing the math by hand

        o  Wireframe rendering of the 2D projection

        o  Hidden line rendering

        o  Scanline rendering using:
            - Painter's algorithm.
            - BSP trees.
            - Z buffer
            - Other

        o  Raytracing

        o  Radiosity

        o  Holographic projection to film

        o  Combination of any of the above


Direction-finding and directional monitoring receivers. Can you say "little
black bakery truck"?

:-)

David


The Babe and The Pride of the Yankees offer very different renditions of
the sotry about Ruth and Gherig hitting home runs for the boy in the
hospital.  Can some historian out there explain "history's" version of the
story.

I wouldn't put is past either (or both) of the movies to season the truth
with a little extra spice.

Any other comments as to inaccuracies in these two movies?

------------------------------

Eric A. W. Behrens
behrens@cc.swarthmore.edu

"I'd walk through hell in a gasoline suit to keep playing baseball."


For sale : Red Honda Scooter (150cc)

Need m/c license
Max speed - 63 mph
Gas mileage - 74 mpg
Max wt - 250 lbs
Odo. reading - 3000 miles
  - it has only been out of the factory for 3 years
  - very low mileage
Original Owner - all paperwork available
Very thorough tune-ups quarterly
Year - 1986
Body - Not a scratch, garaged and covered always
Cover and 2 helmets included
Good for student or light commuter or for fun :)
$1300 or best offer

e-mail or call in evenings
Susan Hodapp
(919)833-8431


This sounds like a good question, the hardware is specific to him, but
in general please respond to him via news and not e-mail.  There probably
are alot of people wanting to read the replies, including myself.
mike
packard@aplcomm.jhuapl.edu


*** On 04-20-93  21:25, Larry Henson had the unmitigated gall to say this:

 LH> Hello, I am trying to hook an Apple Imagewriter to my IBM Clone.
 LH> I seem to have a problem configuring my lpt port to accept this.  How
 LH> can you adjust baud, parity, etc. to fit the system?  I tried MODE, but
 LH> it did not work.  If anyone can help, post of e-mail.  Thanx.

LPT ports don't recognize baud, parity, etc. settings.  You might be tring
to connect a serial printer to a parallel port.  Try this: attach the serial
port of the printer to a serial port on the PC.  Use the mode command to set
the COM port settings.  Try

C>MODE COM1,9600,N,8,1

to set the port parameters.  Then use the MODE command to redirect the
printer port LPT1 like this:

C>MODE LPT1=COM1

This should work.  Good luck!

... Time flies like an arrow.  Fruit flies like a banana.
--- Blue Wave/QWK v2.10


: The real question here in my opinion is what Motorola processors running system
: 7 on a MAC are comparable to what Intel processors running Windows on a PC?  I
[stuff deleted]
: -David
--
Even better than that...  how does a 68000-based Amiga 2000 perform in
daily tasks compared to my 68030-based IIci.

Answer, except in a very few cases, I get my butt kicked by the Amiga.
Sure there are other considerations, but it goes to show you how
proper design from the beginning (in hardware and software) can give
you great returns.  [as well as showing you that if you don't have a
marketing department to speak of, no one will care how good your system is]

I'm still happy with my ci, but I don't understand why the performance is
so bad (comparatively).  They could have done multi-tasking _properly_.
They could have done everthing else better -- but apple didn't.
(of course DOS 6 and windows 3.1 are nothin to write home about either!!)

Oh well, y'all got $2.00 worth for the price of $0.02

~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=
  Peter Pundy

  Email: 2545500@jeff-lab.queensu.ca


        What if we remove one zeron and make it "the genocide of two hundred
        thousands Muslims in Bosnia..", would that make it any better..?
        And how about the 2,000,000 Muslims who were driven and continue to
        be driven out of their homes..? is that "utterly ridiculous claim"?
        And how about the rapes (over 60,000 women) and the concentration
        camps..? The us delegation which visited them reported yesterday
        on CNN that the serbs are giving the muslims detainees 4 biscuits
        and a cup of water a day..!!??
        That sure also sounds like an "utterly ridiculous claim".!


Well, we're not.  Which goes to prove you still don't understand what
we're saying here.

I've lived through the bombing of Cambodia; My Lai; inflated body counts
in VietNam; the funding of Noreiga; Watergate; Contragate; Chappaquiddick;
Kent State; domestic spying by the CIA; Edwin Meese's Pornography
Commission; the War on Drugs; civil seizure; the MOVE disaster; the LA
disaster; and now Waco.

Do you really believe that government always does what is right?

Watch the news for the next couple of months.  Watch how this whole
government-initiated debacle turns into shouting for "more gun control."
It's already started.
--


Sorry, but I'd have to differ.  The Canadian-bashing wrt to the health
insurance system is largely with little evidence or prompting.  Having
kept up with this debate on the net for some months, just about all the
criticism of the Canadian system has misquoted or misinterpreted even
the anti-Canadian propaganda put out by the American insurance industry
and the AMA.

In a few cases, such as Mr. Case, the critiques are well-reasoned and
worthy of response.  Most others are misinformed, illogical,
or just plain dumb.  I don't think the same can be said of the "American
proponents" of the Canadian system, much less of the Canadian proponents.

jsh


I've tried it, and so has one friend of mine.  No known side effects or
risks.  It didn't seem to work for us, but several studies now have
suggested it does work for many people, so I think it's worth a try.

You can find it in capsule form at health food stores.  Up to six capsules
a day was recommended, if I remember correctly.  It can also be prepared
as a tea.

Good luck,


I know that "must" is a verb in some languages.   I'm complaining
about the assertion containing the word must.


In Massachusetts, you will likely be arrested for murder, but
if you convince the cops/DA that you used lethal force because
of threat of death or serious bodily harm, then the charges
would probably be dropped.  If you run away and are later caught,
then you will have a much harder time convincing cops/judge/jury
of your innocence.  Going "on the lam" is seen as an indication
of guilt by a lot of people.


Mike Schmidt's 500th:  Not only a milestone, but also a 9th inning game-
winner.
                           -John


	Recently, I heard the Red Sox on WROL a Spanish-speaking radio station.
I thought it was so unreal. The Red Sox in Spanish? Anyway, I want to find
out how widespread this is? Being a NY native, I know the scMets are on in
Spanish but not the Yankmes. I wuold think that LA,SD,Texas and Fla are on
in Spanish. Are there any Spanish-speaking networks or is this a local


: Actually I am entering vet school next year, but the question is
: relevant for med students too.

: Memorizing large amounts has never been my strong point academically.
: Since this is a major portion of medical education -- anatomy,
: histology, pathology, pharmacology, are for the most part mass
: memorization -- I am a little concerned.  As I am sure most
: med students are.

: Can anyone suggest techniques for this type of memorization?  I
: have had reasonable success with nemonics and memory tricks like
: thinking up little stories to associate unrelated things.  But I have
: never applied them to large amounts of "data".

: Has anyone had luck with any particular books, memory systems, or
: cheap software?

: Can you suggest any helpful organizational techniques?  Being an
: older student who returned to school this year, organization (another
: one of my weak points) has been a major help to my success.

: Please no griping about how all you have to do is "learn" the material
: conceptually.  I have no problem with that, it is one of my strong
: points.  But you can't get around the fact that much of medicine is
: rote memorization.

: Thanks for your help.
The only suggestion i can think of off the top of my head is get a large
supply of index cards and memorize small amounts of info at a time, making
flash cards and quesitons. Everytime i get a question wrong I always
manage to get the damn thing right the next time


FOR SALE:

AT&T Dataport Internal 14.4K Fax/Modem

The modem is an internal AT/(E)ISA 8-bit card (just a little longer
than a half-card).  It has v.32bis for 14.4Kbps data / 9600 bps fax,
v.42, v.42bis, and MNP5 for error-correction and data compression, so
you can get error-free links up to 57,600 bps on a conventional phone
line.  They will "fall back" to any speed (down to 1200bps) and even
disable compression and error-correction if necessary in order to
connect with slower and older modems.

It has a 16550 buffered UART for better compatibility with
multi-tasking operating systems (Windows, OS/2, Unix, etc).

They use a patented technology called Optical Line Interface (OLI)
which reduces noise generated by the modem to assure the fastest and
cleanest connection possible.

These modems come with a lifetime warranty and free lifetime tech
support (and the call is free, too) from AT&T.

They also include the lovely and talented QuickLink II for DOS and the
NEW QuickLink II for Windows communications and fax software which
will let you conveniently sent faxes from any DOS or Windows
application just by printing.  The Windows version will send faxes of
any font and can include graphics, etc.  The DOS version can fax
graphics and a limited set of fonts (I believe that there are 5 or so,
as well as any HP Laser II resident fonts).

I'm asking $210.00 for this modem (plus Utah tax).  This is at or
below the prices of any other (reputable) manufacturer of an
equivalent modem (including Zoom, US Robotics, etc).  And, it is
backed by a company that will never go away.

This price will include delivery if you live within 20 miles of
downtown SLC.  I can also arrange shipping, or you can stop by my home
to pick it up.  (If you're concerned about installing an internal
modem, let me know and we can discuss an arrangement for including
installation.)

If you're interested, please let me know.  This is an excellent modem
at an excellent price (they normally list for ~$500 and retail for
about ~$300).  I installed one of these last week and it is very nice.

If you have questions about this, AT&T has an info number at
(800) 554-4996, or you can email me and I will attemp to answer them.

The modem will go to the highest bidder I get within the next week.


(sic) Oh, you're really bright. As if nobody would have understood it was a
typo.

Several parents with children who either had at one time or currently were
inside the compound made the aforementioned charges. One parent actually
spoke about said charges (in reference to his 13-year old daughter) WITH
Koresh on the phone.

You missed my point entirely.

Since you're unable to formulate a cogent response, you make a lame joke.

Anti-social. Normally meaning a response against societal norms. Stealing
is sociopathic behavior. It's not an oxymoron to have a GROUP of
SOCIOPATHS. I guess you're NOT a psychologist. Oh well...

Maybe YOU should get an education, my man.

Why won't some assholes use a sig so I can send them mail instead of
wasting bandwidth?


That probably is not true.  But today it may not be much better for
the gay population in general.

Where are all of these studies?  You have cited a few, and my research
shows that there are not that many.  Do Not Confuse a survey as a
study, there is a big difference.  Asking people outside of a polling
booth and adding up numbers is NOT a study.

But this is what you base most of your conclusion upon. Warm
fuzzy feelings.

Maybe he has stated an educated opinion based upon the studies
that involve genetics and psychological influence.  There are a
lot of those types of studies, aren't there?  Try reading some.

This is a crap statement and comparison.  Many people use this sad
and stupid argument.  There is not relationship between alcoholics
and people's sexual orientation- except that some may find what it
really is when they are drunk (repressed inhibition released).

Nonsense- this simply is not true.  I suppose it is a waste of time
to try and tell you to understand what a study presents.  Most of
what you cite does not extrapolate anything, you do.

If people in general would stop using irrational position to oppress
other's and leave our private lives to ourselves, I would have no
support for laws and rules to protect people form this.  But we need
only look at post such as yours to see that they lack rational
thought and intelligent outlooks.


 what is the likely hood of conception if sperm is deposited just outside
the vagina?  ie.  __% chance.
 -------------------------------------------------------------------------


From: jbrown@batman.bmd.trw.com

There are many indications that would have taken place had Saddam
been wanting or planning on going into Saudi Arabia.  There were
none.  This has been openly stated by ex-Pentagon analysts.  Pull.

From: jbrown@batman.bmd.trw.com

Actually, reports from other mid-east countries showed that Hussein
was ready to make concessions due to the sanctions.  We just didn't want
him to - we wanted to crush him, as well as battle-test all these high
tech toys we've built over the years.

From: jbrown@batman.bmd.trw.com

We're also hypocrites of the first magnitude.  Obviously, we don't give
a shit about freedom and democracy.  All we care about is our oil.  Oh,
and the excuse, now that the Soviets are gone from the board, to keep
a sizable military presence in the gulf region.  Care to make bets about
when ALL our troops will come home?

Basically, Saddam was OK with us.  He was a killer, who tortured his
own people, used gas on them, and other horrors - he was a brutal
dictator, but he was OUR brutal dictator.  Once he said "fuck you" to
the US, he became the next Hitler.  The same for Noriega.  He was a
bastard, but he was OUR bastard...until he changed his mind and went
his own way.  Then we had to get rid of him.

David Hunt - Graduate Slave |     My mind is my own.      | Towards both a
Mechanical Engineering      | So are my ideas & opinions. | Palestinian and
Carnegie Mellon University  | <<<Use Golden Rule v2.0>>>  | Jewish homeland!
====T=H=E=R=E===I=S===N=O===G=O=D=========T=H=E=R=E===I=S===N=O===G=O=D=====
Email:  bluelobster+@cmu.edu    Working towards my "Piled Higher and Deeper"


The Duo's can drive Apple's 16" monitor at 832x624 resolution and
256 colors, I think. What non-Apple 16-17" monitors can also be
used? Would a multisync NEC-5FG work as well at the same resolution?
What are the outstanding points of the Apple monitor when compared
with these other monitors?


HI,
 that might look like a dull request, but I have been following this newgroup
for a couple of weeks and It didn't help me make my mind.

  I bought a new 486 machine not long ago after being disconnected from the
pc world for a while (I have been running on an xt 5MHz till last january!!).
The machine I bought came equipped with a ATI VGA XL 24 graphic card. It
gives a very nice picture and the  Windows drivers are pretty stable. The only
problem is that it is quite slow.

I would like to go for a faster card (not in the 400$ range). I saw a lot
of comments on many products over the last weeks, but didn't get an overall
picture clear enough to make a choice. My question is : Could somebody
direct me to a source of information which would help me in my quest.
I would like to get information about :
     - the refresh rates the various cards provide;
     - quality of windows drivers;
     - standard vga performance (non-Windows stuff).

Direct me to a magazine article or something like that (I got winvid.zip
info, but it is not enough). If you have an ISA card you are really satisfied
with it,  let me know.
	If this information is of any use, here is my system configuration:
	- Fujikama 486 33MHz ISA system (Contaq motherboard)
	- monitor DARIUS 14" non-interlaced multisync (up to 1024X768)
                               (can reach 70kHz horizontally)

I would also like to know if it is a standard for video drivers to allow
screen dimensioning and screen positioning by writing on the EPROM of the
graphic card. This is the case with my ATI card and it is very convenient
when changing graphics mode since my monitor is not intelligent
enough to record settings.

Merci a l'avance for any information you would be kind enough to provide me,


********NOTE: FOLLOWUPS go to alt.atheism,talk.religion.misc,talk.origins!

[deleted]

If you say X statement and give it the authority of fact, I will respond
by asking you why. You aren't obligated to say anything, but if your
intent is to convince me that X statement is true, then yes, the burden
of proof is upon you.

If you are merely giving testimony to your beliefs, then you are an egotist.
Why would I care?

To surmise, the burden of proof is upon you if you wish us to believe that
what you say is true.


discussing the fact that there were only 16 players who had ever hit 200
homeruns and stolen 200 bases in their career (while HoJo was batting).
Anyone have a list?  Not as easy as it sounds to come up with all of them.
I couldn't.  Mays, Mantle, Aaron, Henderson, Morgan, Bonds (Dad), ???
Frank Robinson?  Molitor?  Yount?  Guessing now.  I'd be interested to see
the whole list.


Gee, I'd FORGOTTEN about THIS NUT.


    This can be turned around.  The Austrians who should feel guilty about
 their actions during WWII, but don't, justify their anti-semetism by making
 every Israeli action into an atrocity.  The Austrians, Germans and other
 Europeans have extensive trading relations with the Arab block; being
 pro-Arab is good for business.  I don't think that ethics has a thing to
 do about it.


What I'd like to see is the more generic N-dimensional widget set.
I realize, that there wouldn't be a whole shitload of people
who'd want more than 3, but why stop?

All I need is a Widget with up to N viewports showing me different
3-D or 2-D slices of my stuff.

alter,
pat


## Don't forget that 25% had 20 or more partners....
#
#Not surprising.  Remember, that study includes homosexuals as well.

Err, earth to Clayton, you posted this to show that 2% were
homosexual. So if we assume EVERY homosexual was promiscious, that
leads us to conclude that 23 percent of heterosexuals are promiscious.
And that first assumtion is a bad one.

Clayton, it *IS* suprising from the claims you are making.


I was one of the unfortunate people to run into this guy.  I sent him
$30 cash (Stupid, I know) for 4 CDs.  That was the last I heard of him.

I know there were some other people ripped off by this guy.  Has there been
any advances in tracking him down?


The other week I saw a TV program about the american space industry and NASA.
It said that in the 60's they developed a rocket that used ions or nuclear
particles for propolsion.
The government however, didn't give them $1billion for the developement
of a full scale rocket.
Did anybody see this program?
If not, has anybody heard of the particle propolsion system?

Thanx. 8-)


[stuff deleted]

                                         ^^^
				I think you mean HCI here.

[snip]

				Joe


The April 1993 edition of MIX Magazine carries a story on 3DO which
includes pictures of the unit, a schematic of what's inside and some
indication from the people at 3DO as to where they intend to go and in
what stages. (MIX is a trade rag aimed at the professional sound
engineering community.)

The schematic shows a central DMA Engine connecting and mediating between
two Graphics Animation processors (32 bit bus), a 32-bit RISC processor
with math co-processor, Video Decomp module, a control port, an expansion
port (where 3DO hangs its double-fast CD player), 1Mb DRAM, an optional
video port (for editing video) and on the outbound side 1MB VRAM to Video
Processor to TV chain parallel with a DSP to sound chain.

They promise Red Book CD-quality audio, full 30 fps video and a future
connection path to your PC via a PC expansion card.

I am not informed enough to have an opinion about the various means and
methods discussed here. The article, written by Philip De Lancie, does
cover the other machines mentioned in this thread.  I come from the PC
TCP/IP world and see a tremendous potential for bringing connectedness to
the educated consumer; 3DO seems to have the right business partners to
make this happen.

Hope this helps.


I have a SPARC-2 with 2 CGSIX cards in it.  I'd like
to have the R5 server recognize the second card.

I mknod created a /dev/cgsix1 device, but when I brought up the
server, the second device was ignored.

How do I setup the second card?

Note:  If I borrow a cgthree card, and put a cgthree and
a cgsix card in the same SPARC-2 box, the R5 server finds
the second card. I then set the DISPLAY to the
second card, and start a second window manager.

Worse case is I trade cards with someone, but maybe someone
out there has seen this problem already...

email is preferred... post if you must...

Thanks in advance....

Jim


I need info regarding a miniscribe 3.5" half-height drive. There is a
sticker on it with the following,
    MODEL   HDA    PCBA   UNIQUE   TDA
    8425F   09AA   03AB   03AA     -
But the sticker on the biggest chip on the MFM interface has this,
    MODEL   PCBA   TDA
     FXX    03AB

What is the spec of the drive (# of cyl, heads, etc)?
How fast is this drive? Can I use it as a RLL drive?
I also have a SCSI interface that seems to match all the connectors
for this drive. It has this description,
    MODEL   PCBA   E-P   TDA
     AXX    01A    29A
Can I replace the MFM interface by the SCSI interface and use the drive
as a SCSI drive? What would the drive size be? There is a set of jumpers
on the SCSI interface with "6SEL" besides it. What is the use of it?


	1.  Don't hold your finger on it
	2.  When cooking with it use a very small pan and be sure
	  to not spill liquids on the components
	3.  If you do not plan to cook with it there are a number of
	  small cooling fans designed to mount on the chip and plug
	  into your power supply.  Look in Consumer Shoppers.


Can somebody send me a copy of this faq?

Thanks alot!


Hi!

We have an old Montage FR-1 35mm film recorder. When connected to a PC with
its processor card it can directly take HPGL, Targa and Lasergraphics Language
files. 24 bit Targa is quite OK for raster images, but conversion from
whatever one happens to have can be quite slow. This Lasergraphics Language
seems to be (got the source file for one test image) a vector-based language
that can handle one million colors. It does some polygons too, and perhaps
something else ?

The question is, where can I find some information about this language ?
A FTP site, a book, a company address,.... ?

(OK, it would be nice to have a Windows driver for it, but I'm not THAT
optimistic...)

Thanks in advance for any help!

	jussi


Even better.  Make up pete conrad in a Martian Suit,
and have him get ou;t  and throw a football
to the refs.


Hi there,

I have a problem here, I've lost the software drivers and
setup programs for my Hardcard.  Can someone email me the
files, or let me know if Plus Development (were they
bought out by Quantum?) has a BBS or phone #?

I have a Hardcard II XL50.


The people involved in it have been building hardware rather than writing
press releases.  This is not a high-manpower project; they don't *have*
spare people sitting around.

As I understand it, there has also been some feeling on the part of some
of the project management that publicity was not a good idea.  A lot of
people have been working on changing this view, with some success.


Will someone who can 'see' the X-Face included in this header please reply
and tell me if it turned out okay?

I'm not all too sure about my viewing software.  I *hand*-converted this
thing in "vi" from a Sun rasterfile... what a pain!

For folks who haven't the slightest, it went like this:

-------------------------------------------------------------

		How to Make Your Own X-Face:
		   in 0x000F Easy Steps!

	1. Scan my Drivers' License into a *.PCX file.
	2. Use WinGIF to 'trim' my face out of the license,
		'reduce' it by half, and
		convert it to *.BMP.
	3. Use Paintbrush to touch up manually.
	4. Use WinGIF to 'reduce' it by half again.
	5. Use Paintbrush to touch up again.
	6. Use WinGIF to 'reduce' it by half *again*
		and convert it to *.GIF.

		[now over to the UNIX side...]

	7. Use Snapshot to convert the *.GIF to a Sun rasterfile.
	8. Use IconEdit to touch it up and
		convert it to an X bitmap.
	9. Use "vi" (yes, a *text* editor) to manually convert
		the rasterfile into the "Uncompressed X-Face" format.
		(Lots of global "ed" commands, and by the time you're
		 done you'll mirror hex bytewise in your sleep!!)

		[now over to the *Linux* side...]

	A. Use "compface" to convert it to what you see here:

 %:A<m@Dob}BO"'E",EEQGbn7qy(En7aS5U([k//"G{6^HIbY9X8~+PD($}6szF"&vVxCXSn
 8mw^0G#nVHE%W,`X"[j0s{r.~%zs:O|HFU=LwzYgH

	B. Try viewing it by whatever means you have available.
	C. Go back to step 9, but do it *right* this time.


hahahahahahahahahahaha - thanks for that, I haven't laughed so much in
ages!