1991 Toyota Camry for sale:
    Deluxe package
    5 speed
    grey
    power windows
    power door locks
    AM/FM cassette
    power steering
    power brakes
    70K highway miles
    Excellent condition

    $9500                             Rob Fusi
                                      rwf2@lehigh.edu
    (609) 397-2147 after 7pm          E-mail me for more info...
    (914) 335-6984 day (until 5)
    Ask for Bob Fusi


I would like to hook up some cameras that were recently donated to our
local community cable TV station which have sync inputs in the form
of horizontal and vertical drive. Our station sync is a black burst
which works fine with other boxes with "genlock" style inputs. Can
anyone point me at a design, article, or whatever showing how to produce
the horizontal & vertical drive signals? Thanks in advance.
Jack Powers


[re McElwaine]

I just heard this week that he has started on COMPUSERVE flying models
forum now.  Sigh.
--


I just received some new information regarding the issue of
BCCI and whether it is an Islamic bank etc.

I am now about to post it under the heading

"BCCI".

Look for it there!


A "moment of silence" doesn't mean much unless *everyone*
participates.  Otherwise it's not silent, now is it?

Non-religious reasons for having a "moment of silence" for a dead
classmate: (1) to comfort the friends by showing respect to the
deceased , (2) to give the classmates a moment to grieve together, (3)
to give the friends a moment to remember their classmate *in the
context of the school*, (4) to deal with the fact that the classmate
is gone so that it's not disruptive later.

Blindly opposing everything with a flavor of religion in it is
utterly idiotic.


nnget 93122.1300541

And where do you advise people to turn for cancer information?

 Most

It seems to me you've offered a circular refutation of Moss's organization. Who
has shown the information in the latest book of PAC to be questionable? Could
it be those 'regulatory' agencies and medical industries which Moss is showing
to be operating with *major* vested interests. Whether one believes that these
vested interests are real or not, or whether or not they actually shape medical
research is a seperate argument. If one sees a possibility, however, that these
interests exist, then the 'fact' that some of the information put out by PAC
has been refuted by the medical industry doesn't hold much weight.

As for the ineffectiveness of antineoplasteons, the fact that the NIH didn't
find them effective doesn't make much sense here. Of course they didn't! I
tend to have more faith in the word of the patients who are now alive after
being told years ago that they would be dead of cancer soon. They are fighting
like hell to keep that clinic open, and they credit his treatment with their
survival. Anyone who looks at the NIH's record for investigation of 'alterna-
tive' cancer therapies will easily see that they have a strange knack for find-
ing relatively cheap and nontoxic therapies dangerous or useless.


	Generally the ship sinks (sorry, there's a picture of the
USS Iowa next to my desk).

	First, unless that round is chambered there is little threat of
penetration by the bullet, or the brass for that matter.  Unless that
expanding gas is held in an enclosed space you get a nice "pop" and not
enough threat for even firefighters to worry about.  Finally, it's
rather simple to tell if a person was shot prior to being burned to
a crisp.  See, by the time the ammunition went up those people were
quite dead.  Look for blood around the wound, particularly bruising.

	However, it's my contention that it makes little difference
whether they died from exploding ammunition or fire; the Feds seem
to have shared responsibility for both.


Has anybody heard an explanation of why the FBI was using tear gas
in a 35 mph wind?

Doesn't seem like vry good tactics to me ...

Any other explanations?

Lew


LOCATION:       Corona del Mar, CA  (Orange County)

FOR SALE:       contemporary custom couch
                7' long ( 3 cushions)
                solid Black
                raw silk-like material
                rolled armrests
                clean design
                excellent condition (left behind @ parents when moved
                                     out of state)
                $450. or best offer

FOR SALE:       Wurlitzer Console Piano w/bench
                Cherry wood
                great condition
                $600. or best offer


I agree with Nick.  What's the big deal about long games?  If you want
to watch baseball, there's that much more baseball to watch.  And yes,
baseball includes the space between plays as well as the plays themselves.

I suspect that a lot of the complaining about long games, especially when
it's coming from TV people, has to something to do with advertising.
Probably time "wasted" in the middle of an inning, say by a batter
stepping out of the box to fiddle with his gloves, or by a pitcher
walking around behind the mound trying to collect his thoughts, could
otherwise be sold as advertising time.


Why can't an aircraft be designed so that the pilot can always be
maintained in a upright position, perpendicular to the plane of
acceleration?  With the visual helmets now being used that display
some of the flight parameters and with a keyboard and manuvering
equipment moving with the pilot, a pilot may be able to function at
accelerations in excess of 12G.  Is anyone currently pursuing this
area or is there a reason why this is impossible at the present time?


exit


The original poster, John Navitsky, said that he might use the monitor on
a SparcStation LX. The LX is able to generate a picture at 1280*1024 at
76 Hz. Not officially, but I tried to set this resolution and refresh rate
and the LX came up with a non-syncing screen. Our tube obviously couldn't
handle this speed. At 67 Hz, it worked perfectly.

When buying a third party monitor that's going to be used on a SparcStation
LX, you might consider a monitor that's fast enough to do 1280*1024 at 76Hz.
I don't know for sure whether the LX supports this (Sun certainly won't tell
you) so you'll have to check.


While I don't have an answer for you, I reckon Blaise Pascal is generally
credited with inventing the syringe per se.  I don't know much about the
needles; however, I do know of a southwest Virginia country doctor who
some thrity or more years ago invented, patented, used, and sold a syringe/
hypodermic needle combination that retracted, injected with the flip of a
trigger, then retracted, giving a near-painless injection.  The fellow was
Dr. Daniel Gabriel, and it was termed the Gabriel--somebody else syringe.
Did you come across that one.  (Plastic, disposable syringes came onto the
market about that time and his product went by the wayside, to my knowledge.)


This is a point that seems to have been overlooked by many. The ending of a
1600 year old schism seems to be in sight.

The theologians said that the differences between them were fundamentally
ones or terminology, and that the Christological faith of both groups was
the same.

Some parishes have concelebrated the Eucharist, and here in Southern Africa
we are running a joint theological training course for Coptic and Byzantine
Orthodox.

There are still several things to be sorted out, however. As far as the
Copts are concerned, there were three ecumenical councils, whily the
Byzantine Orthodox acknowledge seven.


-->
-->What, a dog weighs 150lb maybe, at max? You can't handle it?
-->
-->You have, I presume, thumbs? Grapple with it and tear it's head
-->off!
-->
-->Sheesh, even a trained attack dog is no match for a human,
-->we have *all* the advantages.
-->
--
--This was a recent discussion on rec.martial-arts.  Humans definitely don't
--have all the advantages. Dogs are deceptively strong and often bred for
--fighting of one sort or another.

--Ed
--DoD #1110

Being related to former trainers, I have come to know that humans do have all the
advantages (well, at least one anyway). It is a little known fact that a dog will
involuntarily regurgitate and release an object that is too large to swallow. I
was told that if I were ever attacked by a dog I should ball my hand in a fist and
force it down the dog's throat. The dog would naturally gag and release, and become
momentarily disoriented. This commonly happens to humans when we go to a doctor and
have our throats examined ( Proof Positive ). In the time during the dog's
disorientation, the next move would be to wrap an arm about the dog throat in a
choke hold manner and constrict with all your might until the dog lapses into
unconsciousness ( from lack of oxygen and halting blood flow ). Finally, run like
the wind to get away from the local area should the dog get up again and be really
pissed.

OOOOOOOpsssss. For a second there I thought I was in rec.beatthelivingcrapoutofadog
and not rec.motorcycles.

Till next time.


1) I think that most of us can afford a stamp and an envelope, and the
cost of printing out a letter.

2) If some kind soul out there would write a letter, and upload it to
the net, everyone could capture it, print it out, and snail-mail it
out to their local congressional critter.

BTW>> I'm working on one.

-nate


Well, that post was not that accurate.  People with early life hernias
are felt to have a congenital sack that promotes the formation of hernias.
The hernias of later life may be more associated with chronic straining.
However, the risk of damage to the intestine without an operation is
high enough that it ought to be repaired.  The risk of cancer is probably
no higher than the general population, but since you are near 40, it would
be sensible to have some sort of cancer screening, such as a flexible
sigmoidoscopy.  Sorry for the misleading info.


----------------------------Original message----------------------------
                                                                    D"SB

Below please find an electronic copy of a leaflet put up at Warsaw U.:

DEGEL*HATORAH Jewish Circle for Arts and Sciences,
University of Warsaw, Warsaw, invites you to the lecture
*PRESENT-DAY SOCIOPOLITICAL ISSUES OF THE MIDDLE EAST*
which will be delivered by Dr Mohamed SOLIMAN,
Egypt's Ambassador to Poland.
Time & place: 4 p.m., Tuesday, 25th May, '93, (Erev Shavuot;
Dept. of Arabic & Islamic Studies, Oriental Institute
(Polish: Orientalistyka), University of Warsaw,
26/28 Krakowskie Przedmies'cie Street, PL-00-927 WARSAW, Poland.

:molahs ahetovit'n lohk'v       *       ma(on yehk'rad ahehkar'd
                              *   *
#############       *   *   *   *   *   *   *       ############
#############         *   *           *   *         ############
           #            *               *                     #
#          #          *   *           *   *                   #
#          #        *   *   *   *   *   *   *                 #
                              *   *
                                *

DEGEL*HATORAH  Judaistyczne Kol/o Nauk i Sztuk
przy Uniwersytecie Warszawskim w Warszawie
zaprasza na wykl/ad pt.
*AKTUALNE ZAGADNIENIA SPOL/ECZNO-POLITYCZNE BLISKIEGO WSCHODU*,
kto'ry wygl/osi Dr Mohamed SOLIMAN, Ambasador Egiptu w Polsce.
Czas i miejsce: 16:00, wtorek, 25 maja, '93, (Erev Shavuot;
Zakl/ad Arabistyki i Islamistyki, Instytut Orientalistyczny,
Uniwersytet Warszawski, 26/28 Krakowskie Przedmies'cie,
PL-00-927 WARSZAWA.


It was 93%-94%, and actually another msdos team member posted it.
Note that people not on the msdos team would not necessarily know
about that, or...

When I heard those numbers I wondered how they got them (having
worked in product support and knowing that the typical support caller
has very little positive to say about the product, I figured it wasn't
from there...) so I wandered over to the marketing folks and asked.
And I was told it was from a survey of registered users.  And I
posted that on the net when people asked where the 93% figure came
from.

Hmm. I figured, if Chuck posted the numbers, why not include where
they came from? (I also find it interesting that postitive info is
"fear, uncertainty & doubt".)

????  I think you've got me confused with someone else. I don't
pretend that MSDOS provides what all people need, or that other
OSes (including unix & OS/2) don't provide useful and/or necessary
features.  I also don't push people to use MSDOS; I even posted in
comp.os.msdos.misc that I suggest _waiting_ before installing a
new os, esp if you have trouble (support is always overloaded
during release, unless the sales are a total bomb).

I ain't saying some of us don't get defensive sometimes. Do you *really*
think msdos gets any more respect within microsoft than outside it?

I just mean we all aren't cut out of the same dough with the same cookie
cutter. We don't all think alike.  Yeah, ChuckSt and I have some "inside"
info on MSDOS - doesn't mean that everyone else does :)

-jen

--


a user on my bbs "accidentally" deleted his vga driver for his oak77 card and
has no backup.  i was wondering if someone knew of an ftp site (and path,
please!) where such a thing might be obtained.  thanks.


MAG Innovision MX15F
Fantastic 15" multiscan monitor that can display up to
1280x1024 noninterlaced (!) with .26 mm dot pitch.
If you are looking for a large crystal clear super vga
monitor then this is for you.
$430   call Scott at (503) 757-3483 or
email scotts@math.orst.edu


I have never said that only humans are the only beings which are
sufficiently sentient to have intentions.   In fact, I have explicitly
said that I am perfectly happy to consider that some animals *are*
capable of forming intentions.

What I am objecting to is considering programmed or instinctive
behaviour to have moral significance, since, it seems to me,
such behaviour does *not* involve intention.

That's not the point.   The point is whether the implementor thinks
*at all*.    The issue is not whether thinking produces opinion A
or opinion B, but whether thinking takes place, period.

Since humans are part of nature, are not all human actions "natural".

Or perhaps you're going to throw in a definition of "natural" that
will allow us to describe some actions as "natural" and some as
"not natural".   If so, what is the definition?

Sure they do, as multiple posters have show you.   Sharks, for example,
eat wounded sharks.   I've personally seen cats eat their newborn.

Are you in some kind of denial?   People give you example after example,
and you go off the air for a week, and then pop up claiming that it
never happened.    It's very strange.

See what I mean.   Here we go again.   What do we have to do: write
up a tailor-made FAQ just for Mr Schneider?


	I swore off taking passengers over ten years ago, but I recall
 Sturgis, 1981 getting some strange looks because my passenger
 was reading a book.  She was so engrossed that she didn't even
 notice when we hit a roadkill to make the hit-of-the-day
 with the riders behind us.


Sorry, Fred, but for the purposes under discussion here, I must
disagree.  Your point is true only in the sense that one cannot argue
against communism by reference to the Chinese or Soviet empires, since
those did not represent *true* communism.  In judging the practical
consequences of Islam as a force to contend with in the world today,
it is precisely the Khomeini's of the world, the Rushdie-fatwa
supporters, and perhaps more importantly, the reaction of the world
Muslim community to those extremists, that we must look to.  Perhaps
unfortunately from your perspective, most people are not concerned
with whether Islam is the right religion for them, or whether the
Qur'an could be used as a guidebook for a hypothetical utopia, but how
Islam affects the world around them, or what their lives might be like
if Islam gains in influence.  When I consider such possibilities, it
is with not inconsiderable fear.


Well, if you have an IRWIN 250 MB, here is a great deal for you:
Genuine IRWIN accuTRAK 120-250 tapes, $16/ea
3M DC2120 tapes. $16/ea

All the avove tapes are new, never used, and factory preformatted.
Email if interested.

Feng


So now you are saying that an Islamic Bank is something other than
BCCI.

Would you care to explain why it was that when I said  "I hope an
Islamic Bank is something other than BCCI", you called me a childish
propagandist.


Steve Bellovin writes a well-thought-out and nearly persuasive article about
why the Clipper (are we still calling it Clipper today, or have they figured
out a non-infringing word yet?) protocol is almost as good as one can do
given their marching ordes.

I'll accept the second assumption only for the sake of argument.  In my
view the primary remaining flaw is that the encryption algorithm is
secret, leading to suspicion that there is a back door.  Without complete
disclosure this suspicion cannot be dispelled, no matter how many trusted
experts are allowed to look at it in isolation.

Is it possible to do this whole thing with a public algorithm?  The only
concern I've seen with making Skipjack public is that someone could build
Clipperphones without registering the keys.  Assume F can really be kept
secret as the Government assumes.  Then as part of the initial connection,
a Clipperphone executes a protocol with the Pseudophone to demonstrate
that they both know F.  For example, the initiating phone picks a number Q
and sends E[Q; F].  The receiver sends back E[Q+1; F], and the initiator
sends back E[Q+2; F] to demonstrate that her first packet wasn't just a
random 64-bit block.  Repeat in the opposite direction with another Q so
it can't be defeated by somebody building up a library of sequential
numbers by remembering responses and using those responses as the initial
numbers of subsequent challenges.  This way Clipperphones will talk only
to other Clipperphones.  Of course the Pseudo Company can build their own
proprietary Skipjack phone, but the Presidential Fact Sheet implies that
they won't get approval for it without equivalent key escrow.

What's wrong with this picture?  It depends of F staying secret and on
Skipjack being resistant to cryptanalysis, but the Government appears to
believe in both of these.  Even if the particular Q&A I suggest has some
flaw, I imagine there's a zero-knowledge-proof protocol that doesn't.

Agreed.  My view, and you can quote me: if it's not worth doing, it's
not worth doing well.


But it is subject to all kinds of bias, and is almost completely useless
for first basemen.  From the raw stats, there is no way to tell which of
a first baseman's putouts were made on throws from other fielders, and
which were made on his own plays; likewise, you can't tell whether a
double play was 6-4-3 or 3-6-3.  Fielding Runs thus gives a first
baseman no credit for putouts or double plays, only for assists and
errors.

It thus favors first basemen who play deep, reaching a lot of balls but
forcing the pitcher to cover first more frequently.  It also hurts first
baseman who play behind left-handed pitching staffs and thus face few
left-handed batters.

This is better; of course, it still isn't all of a first baseman's
defense.

Defensive Average, which uses larger (and probably better) zones, has
Mattingly tied for second in the league.

While 233 batting runs is good, it is mostly in the past; the runs he
produced in 1986 don't say much about his value in 1993.


According to an AP report (from Texas, written by Jaime Aron) this morning,
in addtion to the gas pumped in by hoses from CS generators, canisters of
tear gas were thrown into the building from armored vehicles, one of the
canisters hitting a man inside in the face.

This was in the part of the article *before* going into differences in
the stories told by BD survivors and the gov't.

Tear gas canisters *used* to be able to start fires...

--


For some reason my fingers want to type "probably" cause whenever I want to
say "probable" cause. Sorry for any confusion in the previous message.

David


Please do not reply to this account - posting for a friend:

GT-BMX bike, chrome frame, blue, alloy parts, z-rims, mint condition
asking $300 obo.

Apple IIe 64k, floppy drive, monitor, Okidata Microline 92 printer, modem,
and 30 disks of stuff.  Asking $400 obo.


Hi,

	I own a IIsi and I'm considering buying a Powerbook.  Can
anyone give me a listing of all the models and tell me what I'm looking for,
i.e. passive matrix vs. active, memory sizes, upgradeability, internal modems,
disk size.  If you could provide some prices too that would help.  I'm not
informed enough on Powerbooks to know how well they operate.
	I have been following the posts on some of the problems that have been
encountered such as the trackball not working in the horizontal.
	I would appreciate the list as well as any advice you may have.


:
: Dear, dear.  They could have COME OUT.
:


You said everyone in the world.  That means *everyone* in the world, including
children that are not old enough to speak, let alone tell lies.  If Jesus
says "everyone", you cannot support that by referring to a group of people
somewhat smaller than "everyone".
--
"On the first day after Christmas my truelove served to me...  Leftover Turkey!
On the second day after Christmas my truelove served to me...  Turkey Casserole
    that she made from Leftover Turkey.
[days 3-4 deleted] ...  Flaming Turkey Wings! ...
   -- Pizza Hut commercial (and M*tlu/A*gic bait)


:

I'm responding at the risk of misreading your response, but I do have to tell
my fellow conservatives to give it up, attacking Reno/Clinton/ATF/FBI.

They may have botched an operation, but they didn't kill anybody who never shot
at them first.  David Koresh was a frigging lunatic.  His followers had the
combined I.Q of a Geraldo audience.  The kids probably would have been those
fucked up social rejects who go to Freshman dances in high school, never to be
seen again (except maybe in the band) until prom, when they show up like
animals boarding the ark.  Then it's bowling till 3 in the morning.....
(WHY....WHY?? did it happen to me??!!)

Anyway, the point is Janet Reno/Bill Clinton were only following the advice of
trained, law enforcement officials who were experts in their fields.  I'd
rather have our leaders do that then micro-manage every crisis that comes
along.  Then you'd really see trouble no matter what party or ideology the
President and her (er.. I mean his) Attorney General is.
--
Ryan C. Scharfy


This is getting sad.  All you can do is make this ridiculous statements,
based upon some old information and a Press Democrat article that was
poorly written.

Please show the numbers for your use of "MUCH more".  I have not seen
them.  And I want them to be true and accurate, or at least show a
trend within the everyday gay population.

There are all kinds of 'damaged and screwed up' people, and most of
them are not gay.


.....

I'll sell mine for $200 O.B.O.  -  Never Used, I've decided I just don't
have the time to get into C++.


                                                                      ^^^^^^^
        ^^^^
Please pardon my ignorance if this is well known, but what is the current
rule?

Maybe we could limit the number of throws to first that the pitcher can make,
and award a balk if he exceeds it.  I'd have another question:  who would
operate the pitch clock?  One of the umpires?  Add another one to the crew?

I'm not sure I like this idea.  I think it would severely diminish the
number of stolen bases and limit the availability of such neat strategic
ploys as the hit and run and the squeeze play (one of my personal favorites).

Ahhh!  I suppose I should read the whole article before I hit the 'f' key,
eh?  Obviously, from what I wrote above, I like this idea.

It may also increase the number of wild throws to the bag, since the
pitcher knows he doesn't have very many chances to pick off the runner,
so he may hurry too much.  I'd rather see runs scored as the result of
sound hitting and sound baseball strategy rather than on the sloppiness
that could result from this kind of rule.  So, I suppose there are some
disadvantages to that idea too.

I remember in little league, if when up to bat we stepped out of the batter's
box, even for a moment, we were automatically out.  That may be a little
harsh for the majors, but seriously, how about putting a limit on the
batters being able to step out, take several dozen practice swings, pound
their shoes, scratch their balls, etc.?  Maybe forcing them to stay in the
batter's box wouldn't be such a bad idea.  That could save a few minutes.


: As you know all ready, it is the pattern in the bioplasmic energy
: field that is significant.

No, I didn't already know that.  I've never even heard of a
"bioplasmic energy field."  Care to explain it?  It's been a few years
since my last fields class so I may have forgotten (or maybe I skipped
that day).  Anyway, as Ross Perot said, I'm all ears.  Well, eyes in
this case.


Hi.  I'm  looking for information on how to directly manipulate
 video memory.  I have an application that I would like to use this for,
 because it is much faster than going through the BIOS.  I know that
 video memory ispart of the system area above the first 640K, so I guess
 I am looking to find out exactly what section of memory it is, and how it
 is layed out.     Thanks.


I tend to agree, but I would like a better explanation of why the FBI stopped
the firetrucks at the gate.  I saw this in realtime.  It concerns me that the
FBI "appeared" to not be too interested in stopping the fire after it started,
and actually started flying hueys around the compound, which had to add in some
small part to the winds driving the fire.

Jim
--
jmd@handheld.com


Having recently purchased a 93 Probe with clear-coat paint, I
would like to give it a good wax job.  What is the Best type of
wax to use for this type of finish?  Is paste or liquid better?
I would be waxing it by hand, and buffing it by hand, I guess
using cheesecloth to buff it (anything better you would suggest?).

I've heard comments here before about things like Turtle Wax
and Raindance not being very good, so I'm wondering what is
recommended for a quality finish.

Thanks in advance.
Bill


#
# Does anyone know if the following is possible, and if so how do I go about
# doing it.
#
# I want to be able to display remote X11 applications on a VAXstation 2000 off
# of an Internet node. Here is where the problem comes up, the VAXstation isn't
# connected directly to the Internet but is connected via Decnet to a node that
# does have a connection to the Internet. Does anyone know if it is possible to
# get the display to use TCPIP from the remote Internet node down to my local
# Internet node and then send it via Decnet down to the VAXstation 2000?
#

For the machine that is connected to the InterNet, what is it running?  If it
is running VMS, then if you obtain MultiNet for it, MultiNet comes with a
TCP/IP to DECnet gateway for X11.

Patrick L. Mahan

--- TGV Window Washer ------------------------------- Mahan@TGV.COM ---------


Newsgroups: misc.wanted,misc.forsale,misc.forsale.computers,
Subject: Wanted: Manual of Polaroid Palette 72-10; $10
Distribution: world
Organization: Clemson University, Clemson SC

I need the Polaroid Palette Model 72-10 (or similar model) manual.
I am willing to pay $10 for it, plus the shipping charge via USPS 3rd
class.

I don't need the original one, photo-copyed manual will just fine for
me.  If you have the manual, please help me out.

Thanks in advance.

Eric (803)6548817


You can use PBM's 'rawtopgm' to convert three raw (r, g, b) files to pgm format. Then you can use pgm3toppm to convert the pgm files to a composite ppm file,
and feed this to cjpeg for compression. Slow, and circuitous, but it will
work.


Well,  if you're willing to spend a little money,  you could buy one
of those IDE caching controllers (assuming you have an IDE of course)
and put the 256K SIMMs on them.  Hardware cache!


In fact, this "productive human presence" in the desert has, in the
centuries it has been there, produced one of the greatest
civilizations in human history.  They not only created the wheel, but
the printing press, the light bulb, Post-Modern skyscraper
architecture, Broadway theatre and nuclear power, as well.

Right, Elias.  The Negev was a veritable Garden of Eden until the Evil
Jews turned off the rain and turned it into a horrible desert.  Part
of the International Jewish Conspiracy.  Say, who should I call to
turn off the rain here in NY, right now?

Yeah, deserts rarely look like the Garden of Eden.

This is why Nature Reserves people are heavily armed with anti-tank
weaponry.  Just what we need in the Nature Reserves.

Nothing like "vast nuclear reactors" when it comes to hiding them from
air attack.  AT least Saddam had the sense to hide his CBN plants in
"baby milk" factories.

Indeed, many older people recall fondly those lovely tomatoes and
oranges that the Bedouin exported form their Garden of Eden.  In fact,
that region used to supply the entire world with bananas, until the
Jews pushed that business onto the "banana republics".

Elias, you're stupid postings are a source of considerable amusement
and hilarity.  Please don't stop.  I might even have to go back to
watching TV.


I have the following Marx Brothers tapes forsale. I would like to sell
them as a batch if possible. All (except *) are new, carfully stored
copies I bought. I now own the laserdisks.

MGM/UA:
A Day at the Races
At the Circus
The Big Store

MCA
Hourse Feathers
The Cocoanuts
Duck Soup*
Animal Crackers*

--
brian
oplinger@ra.crd.ge.com


I recently purchased an IBM monochrome vga monitor from Mike Damico. The
monitor arrived but it was missing it's power cable. Mike's address is
apparently not a proper address because mail can't reach it. If anyone
knows how to contact Mike and could help me find him I would appreciate it.
I am sure he just set aside the power cord as he was packing the monitor
but it would be a lot more useful to me if I had the cord as well.


It's not quite what you were asking, but a few years ago I helped some EE
remote sensing people run some experiments on the microwave emmissivity of
ice; they used the sky for a background calibration source.  They said that
from Earth's surface the sky looks like a 60K blackbody.


	First you need to connect them with a null modem cable.

Atleast thats what I've heard.


Tasco 18EB 20X-60X60mm, used once, looks like new, worth $170, sell
$70 only.  Buyers pay shipping.


You unfortunately failed to mention if the error occurs with the Parity Error
Checking enabled or disabled.  I assume you mean it gives you a parity error
when it's enabled, and not when it's disabled.  How high will the count go on
the memory check at boot-up before this error occurs?  Does the system beep
at all; if so what's the pattern of beeps?  The error could be occuring in
Cache memory (not so likely) or video memory, as well as the simms.

The fact that you have AMI bios is not conclusive in determining the board
manufacturer either.  Boards are made by thousands of small Taiwanese companies
(among others) that buy the name brand chips and put them together with some
simm sockets to make your board.  I tend to doubt your problem is with your
IDE controller, also.

Anyway, perhaps if you answer those questions someone can help you out better.


Hello everybody out there !

I'm trying to compile X11R5pl23 and Motif 1.2.1 on a HP running
HP-UX 8.05. But it' seems to be not very succesful, because
I have only hp.cf config-files for HP-UX 7.0.

I tried standard cc and X was compiled with a lot of warnings.
The motif applications are compiled quite well, but they won't run.
I receive the XKeysymDB error which is reported in FAQ, but
I cannot fix it. The XKeysymDB-file is at the right location and it
works fine under SunOS.
Probably I have started the compilation Prozess only with a wrong
config-file.

Please help me !

Thanx in advance
  Markus

-----------------------------------------------------------------
 Markus Koch                           Universitaet-GH Paderborn
 Email : raistlin@uni-paderborn.de     Rechnerbetreuung
 Phone : +49 5251 60 3322              Warburger Str. 100
         +49 5251 60 3318              W4790 Paderborn, Germany
-----------------------------------------------------------------
--

-----------------------------------------------------------------
 Markus Koch                           Universitaet-GH Paderborn
 Email : raistlin@uni-paderborn.de     Warburger Str. 100
 Phone : +49 5251 60 3322              W4790 Paderborn, Germany


: That's not inner calm.  It's boredom, and it's being spoiled.  The Arena's
: been as quiet as a church on many nights this year; too many of us just
: take winning for granted.  It's been seemingly forever since the team
: lost, and we've forgotten what it's like to feel real excitement and
: surprise at victory.

At least last night there was some excitement. The Pens
didn't have it wrapped up before the game was half over like
the previous two games. I'm not sure if NJ just rose up and
played better or if the Penguins just started to play down
somewhat. Probably it was somewhere in between. New Jersey
seemed much more aggressive last night in the Pens end. They
did much more swarming around, which at least kept an
element of suspense in the game. No question that Billington
helped make it more interesting also. Claude Lemieux didn't
help the cause any though, with his ejection early in the
game. So, who's going to start in the Devils goal for the
"final" game Sunday? ;-) Sorry. I couldn't help myself.


From: harelb@math.cornell.edu (misc.activism.progressive co-moderator)
Subject: F<O>CUS/HEALTH: How U.S. compares... Children/Elderly in Poverty

F<O>CUS/HEALTH: How U.S. compares... Children/Elderly in Poverty

  ==================================================================
  Percentage of children and elderly living in poverty 1984-1987:(3)
  ==================================================================

=================================================
                      CHILDREN            ELDERLY
COUNTRY              IN POVERTY         IN POVERTY
=================================================
United States           20.4               10.9
Canada                   9.3                2.2
Australia                9.0                4.0
United Kingdom           7.4                5.2
France                   4.6                4.5
Netherlands              3.8                3.4
Germany                  2.8                2.8
Sweden                   1.6                4.3

Source: Timothy M. Smeeding, "U.S. Poverty and Income Security Policy in a
Cross National Perspective, October 1991, Luxembourg, October, 1991,
Luxembourg Income Study, working paper 70.

******************************************************************

=====================================
Of the 19 Western Industrial Nations:
=====================================

Western Industrial Countries having a National Health Insurance plan
providing universal coverage:

Australia      YES    Sweden             YES
Canada         YES    United Kingdom     YES
Denmark        YES    Austria            YES
Finland        YES    France             YES
Ireland        YES    Switzerland        YES
Italy          YES    Spain              YES
Japan          YES    Belgium            YES
New Zealand    YES    Germany            YES
Netherlands    YES    Norway             YES

 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Western Industrial Countries NOT having a National Health Insurance
plan providing universal coverage.

United States       NO

 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

******************************************************************

From page 74 of:

 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
_We're Number One, Where America Stands -- and Falls -- in the New
World Order_ by Andrew L Shapiro.

New York, May 1992, Vintage Books, a division of Random House.
$10 paperback. ISBN 0-679-73893-2
 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[Transcribed by jhwoodar@well.sf.ca.us (Joe Woodard)]

    ``America is becoming a land of private greed and public squalor.
    This book is an indispensable road map through the wreckage. The
    facts it reveals will startle you. They may depress you. But
    ideally they'll fire you up to help rebuild this nation.''


[deleted stuff from Andrew wrt which atheist myth is Bill re: to]

"Counterfeit atheists". Hmmmm. So, we're just cheap knock-offs of the
True Atheists.

Religion demonstrates itself to be absurd. Constantly. Personally, if
someone asks, I'm happy to point out how this is so.

Man, what *is* your pill wrt atheists? If you're going to make such
contentious statements, back them up! At least, READ NEWS: time-and-time
again, we've hashed out the beliefs various religous doctrines hold.
Try debating reasonably with someone who makes a statement like,
"...more accurately oxymoric is the a term like, reasonable atheist."
Then take a look at the responses we've given Tammy. Seem pretty
"reasonable", nay, even "polite" to me.

[accusations of myths a-flyin']

I saw your reference to "According to" in the original article.
Then you do such an excellent job of spewing dogma that, well, the
implication was pretty clear (if wrong, in this case).

[jeez, a misunderstanding. Let it go.]

[more statements to wrap this thing up]

If you had WRITTEN your post with the same as care as the FAQ has been,
we wouldn't be having this discussion.

[gems about evidence deleted]

Jeez, do I have to point this out to you? This discussion is not all
instances of human reason. Therefore, your implication is false.

How lame can you get. Who said anything about the 'truth' of things?
Read the FAQ very carefully, please. Then report your findings about
where it says the purpose of a.a is to find the 'truth' of things.

And stop impressing your own misguided image of atheists upon us. It's
really pissing me off.


: The same works for the horrors of history.  To claim that Christianity
: had little to do with the Crusades or the Inquisition is to deny the
: awesome power that comes from faith in an absolute.  What it seems you
: are doing twisting the reasonable statement that religion was never
: the solitary cause of any evil into the unreasonable statement that
: religion has had no evil impacts on history.  That is absurd.

Scott,

Until this paragraph I would willingly amend my earlier statements,
since your point(s) are well made and generally accurate. This last
part though slips into hyperbole. Since I've discussed my objections to
such generalizations before, I really don't feel I need to do it
again. If you haven't seen those posts, ask Maddi, she saves
everything I write.


: Recently an e-mail to me mentioned:

: (Technically, the messengers aren't even human so
: it *can't* be a case of "homosexuality" -- even of rape.) [...]

: The Jude reference to Sodom is also meaningful only in the context of
: the Sodomites' "lust" for the "other flesh" of angels.  Again,
: application to homosexual behavior in general, or to the position of
: gay Christians is largeely specious.
: ***
: Are angels "flesh"? No. I feel that this is saying that it was because
: of their lust after other men, who are flesh( or of this world).

: what are other opinons on this? I haven't heard much about this verse
: at all.

Bo Reike in the Anchor Bible volume on _James, Peter, and Jude_ points
out that all the examples given in this section of Jude are distinguishing
the elect from _apostates_, not just the wicked in general.  Hence, those
who were delivered from Egypt, but did not follow Moses (and, by extension,
God); the apostate angels; and Sodom and Gomorrah.  Quoting Reike:

	"Fornication may here, as often in the New Testament,
	refer to idolatry, while "flesh" (as in I Pet 1:24)
	denotes human society and its violent attempts at self-
	exaltation.  Sodom and Gommorrah represent the leaders
	of apostasy, and the surrounding cities correspond to
	their followers." [p. 199]

There is no inherent reason to read this verse (7) as literally referring
to actual sexual lust for "alien flesh".  Nor is it inherently necessary
to understand it as referring to homosexuality, outside of the circular
reasoning that has already concluded that the sin of Sodom is the sin
of homosexuality.  The only place that the sin of Sodom is specified, and
not merely inferred, is in Ezekiel 16:49 "This was the guilt of your sister
Sodom: she and her daughters had pride, excess of food, and prosperous ease,
bit did not aid the poor and needy.  They were haughty, and did abominable
things before me; therefore I removed them when I saw it.

For the same reason (overliteralizing the text) your correspondent's
suggestion that the reason the passage doesn't deal with homosexuality
is because the guests were angels and not men is just silly.  There
are much more solid reasons for pointing out the irrelevance of the
Sodom passages for dealing with homosexuality per se.


This pretty much confirms my original impression after reading
through the documentation on dos-6.  The double space sounds nice,
but NOT on your primary disk!!  I'll probably wind up making a
disk partition d: and doublespacing *it*, using it as an archive.
Probably would be useful on floppy disks as well.  But on c:?  Uh, uh...

[I particularly disliked the note that said something like "double
space is irreversible"].

--Cindy
--
Cindy Tittle Moore


My reason for saying that was 'cause _I_, if _I_ were a cop
wouldn't go out of my way to tell people how to break the law.

Would you?

The part about honesty was a joke, sorta.

Obviously, people have had bad experiences with cops
lying.  Obviously, nobody's perfect and nobody
_always_ tells the truth about everything.

(Or are you God? 1/4 ;)


: > From: elf@halcyon.com (Elf Sternberg)
:      Bzzzzt.  THANK you for playing, but obviously you are not reading the
:   material as it is presented.  According to the report I've got in my
:   hands, the Newsweek article (which reported that "2 to 3 percent" of the
:   population is gay) used the criteria of "No heterosexual contact in the
:   past year."  But at the same time, the University of Denver study points
:   out, quite dramatically, that 60% of all self-identifying gay men have
: > had some form of heterosexual contact in the past year.
:
: I think the big mistake in that study must be that if one had had no sexual
: contact of any kind in the previous year, they are counted as heterosexual.
: Even if they didn't intend it that way, that's how the figures are being used.

Could someone please post some date such as what questonnares where used
and how they were distributed and returned.

--


: After reading the posts on this newsgroup for the pasts 4 months, it
: has become apparent to me that this group is primarily active with
: Liberals, Catholics, New Agers', and Athiests.  Someone might think
: to change the name to:  soc.religion.any   - or -  perhaps even
: soc.religion.new.  It might seem to be more appropriate.
: Heck, don't flame me, I'm Catholic, gay, and I voted
: for Bill Clinton.  I'm on your side!

Since when did conservative, protestant, old-time religion believers get
an exclusive francise to christianity?  Christianity is, and always has
been, a diverse and contentious tradition, and this group reflects that
diversity.  I, fo one, am not ready to concede to _any_ group- be they
"liberal" or "conservative", catholic, protestant, or orthodox, charismatic
or not- the right to claim that they have _the truth_, and everyone else
is not "christian."


Here's the scoop:

For the past two years, I have been using an SE/30 with a Sony 1304s and
a Lapis video card.  This past month, I bought a Quadra 800 and am now
using the Sony on it.  My SE/30 has been shipped home to my father who
is planning on getting an Apple 14" monitor (The Trinitron one).  My
question is this:  What kind of power cord will he get with the Apple
monitor.  Does it come with two types?  As I recall, one can hook up the
power cord of an apple monitor to the back of a machine such as my
Quadra 800.  However, for my father's SE/30, there is no extra plug which
allows use of the SE/30's power supply.  He needs to plug it into the
socket separately.  So...does the monitor come with a cable that will allow
him to do this?  Will have to buy a different cable?  IF yes, where can he
purchase such a cable? or apple kind enough to provide both types of cables?

Thanks in advance,
Derek

******************************************************************************
  DEREK FONG                           *   EMAIL: thewho@plume.mit.edu
  Dept. of Physical Oceanography       *          thewho@darla.whoi.edu


I hate to sound flippant, having shot off my mouth badly on the net
before, but I'm afraid that much of this material only adds to my
feeling that "the assumption of Mary" would be better phrased "our
assumptions _about_ Mary."  In all the time I've been reading about
Mary on this group, I can not recall reading much about Mary that
did not sound like wishful veneration with scant, if any, Scriptural
foundation.

I find in the New Testament a very real portrait of Christ's parents
as compellingly human persons; to be honored and admired for their
humility and submission to God's working, beyond doubt.  But the almalga-
mation of theories and dogma that has accreted around them gives me
an image of alien and inhuman creatures, untouched by sin or human
desire.  Only Christ himself was so truly sanctified, and even He knew
temptation, albeit without submitting to it.

I also don't see the _necessity_ of saying the Holy Parents were some-
how sanctified beyond normal humanity: it sounds like our own inability
to grasp the immensity of God's grace in being incarnated through an or-
dinary human being.

I won't start yelling about how people are "worshipping" Mary, etc.,
since folks have told me otherwise about that, but I do think we
lose part of the wonder of God's Incarnation in Christ when we make
his parents out to be sinless, sexless, deathless, otherworldly beings.


Indeed so; it's at the extreme limit of what is humanly possible.  It is
possible only because Mount Everest is at a fairly low latitude:  there
is a slight equatorial bulge in the atmosphere -- beyond what is induced
by the Earth's rotation -- thanks to the overall circulation pattern of
the atmosphere (air cools at poles and descends, flowing back to equator
where it is warmed and rises), and this helps just enough to make Everest-
without-oxygen feasible.  Only just feasible, mind you:  the guys who did
it reported hallucinations and other indications of oxygen starvation,
and probably incurred some permanent brain damage.


DEC LK250-AA PC keyboard for sale:

   - automatically senses machine type and switches between AT/XT modes

   - same exact key layout as DEC's VT2xx, VT3xx, etc., with DEC
        names on keys as well as PC names

   - standard AT/XT cable included

   - great for use with a VTxxx terminal emulator - all the keys are there
        and in the correct place. (i.e. GOLD PF1, PF2, etc.)

   - perfect condition, very good feel

   - $130 + shipping  (DEC price was around $300)

Send email if you have questions.

Thanks,
Keith


	More to the point, how long are atheists going to be insulted
	by the disgraceful addition of religious blah-blah to our
	money and out pledge?
--
	"What's big, noisy and has an IQ of 8?"


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I think you're deliberatly overstating the requirements for OS/2.
Considering that OS/2 is a multi-threaded true multitasking OS and
takes the place of DOS and Windows and more, I actually think the
requirements for OS/2 are very reasoable.  I also think that anyone
using Windows 3.1 without 8 megs of RAM, a 386-40, and 200 megs of
hard drive space, is beating their head against a wall.  Those are
also legitimate requirements for OS/2.  In fact, the requirements
for Windows 3.1 and OS/2 are about equal.


[Much discussion about economics of safety deleted]

This is a very simplistic view of safety. Assuming that you are in a collision
(less likely with a more agile smaller car), then the important factor
is how well does the car sacrifice itself to save you. This is why a thousand
pound F1 car can hit a wall at 200 and the driver walks out and why
everybody dies when a Suburban hits a wall at 35 (as I recall for the last
generation Suburban HIC numbers).

As an aside, just what is the point of an airbag? It seems to me that
seatbelts with pretensioners (Audi et al), or a good tight 5 point belt
will prevent you every moving far enough to hit the airbag. You might be

saved from some flyign glass? Or is an airbag just a lowest common denominator
safety device that is of some use in a head on collision when you are
wearing no seat belt?


: I've seen people in their forties and fifties become disoriented and
: demented during hospital stays. In the examples I've seen, drugs were
: definitely involved.

: My own father turned into a vegetable for a short time while in the
: hospital. He was fifty-three at the time, and he was on 21 separate
: medications. The family protested, but the doctors were adamant, telling
: us that none of the drugs interact. They even took the attitude that, if
: he was disoriented, they should put him on something else as well! With
: the help of an MD friend of the family, we had all his medication
: discontinued. He had a seizure that night, and was put back on one drug.
: Two days later, he was his old self again. I guess there aren't many
: medical texts that address the subject of 21-way interactions.

I saw the same thing happen to my father, and I can more or less validate your
take on hospitals.  It seems to me that medical science understands precious
little about taking care of the human machine.  Drugs are given as a
response to symptoms (and I guess that makes sense since all the studies that
validate the effectiveness of those drugs are based on a narrow
assessment of the degree of particular symptoms).  But there seems
to be very little appreciation for the well-being of a person
outside of the numbers that appear on a test.  I watched my dad
wither away and lose huge amounts of body fat and muscles tissue
while in the hospital.  There is something a little crazy about a
system in which there is more attention paid to giving you every
latest drug available than there is attention paid to whether you
have had enough to eat to prevent loss of muscle tissue.  It is
really, really bizarre.


	Good advice.

	My Ol'lady taps me on the shoulder to let me know she is
	uncomfortable.  I, in turn, am prepared for her to move about on the
	back of the bike.

	We had 1 bad crash (nail in rear tire on left hand sweeper at crest
	of hill on pavement/pea-gravel road) and her actions helped lessen
	the severity of it.  As we were crashing, she stayed upright in the
	saddle with her feet on the pegs and her hands about my waist.  I was
	able to get the bike slowed down 10-15mph before we were high-sided.
	She got off with a fair case of road rash and I had to have the doc
	remove a lot of rocks from my knee.  Had she panicked we would have
	probably crashed at greater speed causing greater injury.
	BTW, as soon at the tire went flat, we went into VIOLENT tank-
	slappers.  This is what she rode out in a "normal" riding posture!

 ----===== DoD #8177 = Technician(Dr. Speed) .NOT. Student =====----


 >
 > Regarding the horror stories about DOS6/DOUBLEDISK and STACKER 2.?
 > killing hard drives:
 >
 > I was wondering if the dos 6 MIRROR command works on the doubled
 > drive info as well as the normal fat table and partition table.
 > If it records the vital DoubleDisk info, then using it daily
 > should go a long way toward protecting yourself against the
 > type of catastrophic failure discussed.  If it doesn't, then
 > shame on Microsoft.
 >

 MIRROR is one of those DOS commands that didn't survive the change
 from DOS 5.0.  It's been dropped, along with BACKUP, JOIN, EDLIN
 and a couple other crummy old DOS commands.  You can still use the
 5.0 commands if you absolutely have to, but they are not included
 on the 6.0 distribution disks.

 However, in MIRROR's case, I'm 99.9% certain that it does not know
 anything about DoubleSpaced drives...

Eric


Are you serious?!!!  Here's an exercise next time you are in the barnyard.
Take *your* model and hold it directly above a fresh cowpie.  Then release the
model.  You will observe that on its own *your* model will assume a trajectory
earthward and come to rest exactly where it belongs.  Watch out for splatters,
particularly if you are wearing shorts when you perform this experiment.


I am not quite so sure about the illegality of using a regular American phone
on your home system. I vaguely remember a few years ago, when "Deutsche
Bundespost" split into Postdienst, Postbank, and Telekom there was some
discussion about a new regulation. I know that cordless or cellular phones
still have to be approved by the Telekom, but does that hold true for regular
phones? In my areacode in Germany (2234 - Frechen, near Koeln) you can use
touch-tone dialing. I assume, however, that most areas are still exclusively
set to pulse dialing. Last time I checked (Jan '93) the Cologne areacode 221
was still solely pulse dialing.

BTW, touch tone does become more common in Germany, bringin with it the
flourishing of 1-900 services (in Germany 0190). I just hope we'll all have
ISDN some time at an affordable price - idle wishes...

Markus Iturriaga
                           "Things go smoother with lard!"
iturriag@utkvx.utk.edu       "Bring back the glory that was grease!"
iturriag@utkvx.bitnet           -East Tennessee Lard Advisory Council

                            MILLARD FILLMORE LIVES!


Can someone elaborate a little on what this "Libertarian" movement is? I
am not going to draw conclusions from a small sample, but so far I
recall two self-described "Libertarians" posting here. Both seems to be:

1) Incredibly ignorant.
2) Incredibly arrogant.
3) All they want is to get people angry.
4) Posses a lousy sense of humor.
5) write incoherently and jump from topic to topic without any logical
   connection between topics.
6) Describe themselves as intelligent and knowledgeable, although everything
   in their posters points to the opposite.
7) Very childish.

Is this some campaign to smear this Libertarian party or what?


Sometimes when I boot up windows 3.1, after the windows logo comes up it han
gs, I am using Dos 6 and doublespace, and a 5 meg temp swap file on an
uncompressed drive.
But when I press the reset button on the computer,  windows boots up
fine... Why is this??? is it dos 6?
--


good but where are these drivers??

anybody at Actix listening?  Upload the dang drivers to an ftp site pleeeeeeese?!

cheers,

Kym

_______________________________________________________________________________

Kym A. Burgemeister
Department of Mechanical Engineering
University of Adelaide
South Australia                                            Ph.   +61 8 228 4713
5005                                                       Facs. +61 8 224 0464


Wow, I hadn't realized how VENOMOUS this was getting!  Be careful here...the
problem isn't the rich but the values and the systems that make the rich
rich.  Things are designed in such a way that in order to go with the system
and make money, everything ELSE we care about goes to shit.  I have to
constantly remind myself that the goal of human society is not to make
money.  Money doesn't make us happy; it just prevents certain things making
us more unhappy.

Therefore, don't shoot the rich.  Shoot the conservatives!

Drewcifer