From pgilbert at bank-banque-canada.ca  Tue Aug 29 22:13:21 2006
From: pgilbert at bank-banque-canada.ca (Paul Gilbert)
Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 16:13:21 -0400
Subject: [Rd] 'CanMakeUseOf' field
In-Reply-To: <44F48E3F.6070903@stats.uwo.ca>
References: <m2wt8sgyo0.fsf@ziti.fhcrc.org>	<17651.65163.240840.365787@stat.math.ethz.ch>	<44F4473D.9030203@bank-banque-canada.ca>	<17652.19292.998960.686119@stat.math.ethz.ch>	<44F46112.7060809@stats.uwo.ca>	<m2d5ajedon.fsf@ziti.fhcrc.org>	<44F47295.2050207@stats.uwo.ca>	<m28xl7ctt3.fsf@ziti.fhcrc.org>
	<44F4865B.5010107@bank-banque-canada.ca>
	<44F48E3F.6070903@stats.uwo.ca>
Message-ID: <44F49FE1.6040002@bank-banque-canada.ca>



Duncan Murdoch wrote:

> On 8/29/2006 2:24 PM, Paul Gilbert wrote:
>
>> Seth Falcon wrote:
>>
>>> Duncan Murdoch <murdoch at stats.uwo.ca> writes:
>>>  
>>>
>>>> On 8/29/2006 11:58 AM, Seth Falcon wrote:
>>>>   
>>>>
>>>>> I think there is an important distinction between a dependency needed
>>>>> for the package to function and a dependency needed to demonstrate
>>>>> said functionality via an example or vignette.  The former is what
>>>>> Depends is about, the latter is something else (Suggests).
>>>>>     
>>>>
>>>> Yes, that's a good point, especially with vignettes.  Only the package
>>>> author needs to be able to run them.
>>>>   
>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, but just to keep things clear: the value of vignettes is that
>>> users can follow along.  So the ability to programatically identify
>>> the extra required packages is valuable.
>>>
>>>  
>>>
>>>> But maybe examples should be considered broken if they don't
>>>> work. Users should be able to expect example(foo) not to generate an
>>>> error.  Package authors should wrap optional examples in code like if
>>>> (require(...)).
>>>>   
>>>
>> This is a work around that is ok for the developer's testing and to 
>> prevent failure on CRAN, and I use it. But, other than actually 
>> reading the examples, it provides no hints to other testers or users 
>> about things that might be installed, or installed first, to give 
>> more complete testing and more functionality.
>
>
> I'm not saying to use this instead of Suggests, I'm saying to do both. 
> This way the Suggests entries really are suggestions:  the examples 
> will run with or without the presence of the suggested packages.
>
> I think there are so many variations on when a Suggested package 
> should be installed, that it's not reasonable to expect to be able to 
> encode them all in a machine readable way.  They should be documented 
> in human readable format.
>
>> Looking toward the future, I think it would be useful to have a 
>> standard mechanism to indicate extensions that are available in a 
>> package, and might be tested and used, but are not necessarily 
>> available on CRAN. For instance, an example might access to a 
>> purchased database or take advantage of  a computer cluster. It seems 
>> limiting to think that all testing that cannot be done on CRAN must 
>> be done almost exclusively by the developer.
>
>
> If by "mechanism" you mean human-readable documentation, I agree with 
> this.

Yes,  I was think of human-readable and in a standard location, like a 
field in the DESCRIPTION file.  (You are thinking of fields in the 
DESCRIPTION file as human-readable, are you not?)

Paul

>
> Duncan Murdoch
>
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>>
>>> I agree.  As with vignettes, there is value in users being able to
>>> follow along and it would be nice to have a programatic way to
>>> identify extra package needed for fancy/involved/optional examples.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> + seth
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________
>>> R-devel at r-project.org mailing list
>>> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-devel
>>>  
>>>
>> ==================================================================================== 
>>
>>
>> La version fran?aise suit le texte anglais.
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
>>
>>
>> This email may contain privileged and/or confidential 
>> inform...{{dropped}}
>>
>> ______________________________________________
>> R-devel at r-project.org mailing list
>> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-devel
>
====================================================================================

La version fran?aise suit le texte anglais.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This email may contain privileged and/or confidential inform...{{dropped}}




[Rd] 'CanMakeUseOf' field
Paul Gilbert