From tom@@@k@liber@ @ending from gm@il@com  Wed Sep  5 10:09:04 2018
From: tom@@@k@liber@ @ending from gm@il@com (Tomas Kalibera)
Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2018 10:09:04 +0200
Subject: [Rd] True length - length(unclass(x)) - without having to call
 unclass()?
In-Reply-To: <CAFDcVCQdmLYM4gPj_zoz4KeoHGGUzJux9hLK_3vMVaeWUsrHQQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAFDcVCQdmLYM4gPj_zoz4KeoHGGUzJux9hLK_3vMVaeWUsrHQQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <d16444c2-a703-d822-bb59-f94c92ecb260@gmail.com>

On 08/24/2018 07:55 PM, Henrik Bengtsson wrote:
> Is there a low-level function that returns the length of an object 'x'
> - the length that for instance .subset(x) and .subset2(x) see? An
> obvious candidate would be to use:
>
> .length <- function(x) length(unclass(x))
>
> However, I'm concerned that calling unclass(x) may trigger an
> expensive copy internally in some cases.  Is that concern unfounded?
Unclass() will always copy when "x" is really a variable, because the 
value in "x" will be referenced; whether it is prohibitively expensive 
or not depends only on the workload - if "x" is a very long list and 
this functions is called often then it could, but at least to me this 
sounds unlikely. Unless you have a strong reason to believe it is the 
case I would just use length(unclass(x)).

If the copying is really a problem, I would think about why the 
underlying vector length is needed at R level - whether you really need 
to know the length without actually having the unclassed vector anyway 
for something else, so whether you are not paying for the copy anyway. 
Or, from the other end, if you need to do more without copying, and it 
is possible without breaking the value semantics, then you might need to 
switch to C anyway and for a bigger piece of code.

If it were still just .length() you needed and it were performance 
critical, you could just switch to C and call Rf_length. That does not 
violate the semantics, just indeed it is not elegant as you are 
switching to C.

If you stick to R and can live with the overhead of length(unclass(x)) 
then there is a chance the overhead will decrease as R is optimized 
internally. This is possible in principle when the runtime knows that 
the unclassed vector is only needed to compute something that does not 
modify the vector. The current R cannot optimize this out, but it should 
be possible with ALTREP at some point (and as Radford mentioned pqR does 
it differently). Even with such internal optimizations indeed it is 
often necessary to make guesses about realistic workloads, so if you 
have a realistic workload where say length(unclass(x)) is critical, you 
are more than welcome to donate it as benchmark.

Obviously, if you use a C version calling Rf_length, after such R 
optimization your code would be unnecessarily non-elegant, but would 
still work and probably without overhead, because R can't do much less 
than Rf_length. In more complicated cases though hand-optimized C code 
to implement say 2 operations in sequence could be slower than what 
better optimizing runtime could do by joining the effect of possibly 
more operations, which is in principle another danger of switching from 
R to C. But as far as the semantics is followed, there is no other danger.

The temptation should be small anyway in this case when Rf_length() 
would be the simplest, but as I made it more than clear in the previous 
email, one should never violate the value semantics by temporarily 
modifying the object (temporarily removing the class attribute or 
temporarily remove the object bit). Violating semantics causes bugs, if 
not with the present then with future versions of R (where version may 
be an svn revision). A concrete recent example: modifying objects in 
place in violation of the semantics caused a lot of bugs with 
introduction of unification of constants in the byte-code compiler.

Best
Tomas

>
> Thxs,
>
> Henrik
>
> ______________________________________________
> R-devel at r-project.org mailing list
> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-devel



[Rd] True length - length(unclass(x)) - without having to call unclass()?
Tomas Kalibera