Author Topic: Army.ca Staff Reset  (Read 7996 times)

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Offline George Wallace

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #50 on: April 22, 2017, 10:44:43 »
Tanknet was using a generic "Moderator" account to intervene on discussions with no indication of who that might be, my understanding is that the staff would discuss a response and it would be broadcast by the "Moderator" (avatar was the "Eye of Mordor"). This helped removed personal attacks on staff.

However, how fast do they act when something needs immediate attention?  Take for instance the numerous SPAMMERS who have come onto the site spamming sales pitchs for such things as fake documents and several members do a REPORT TO MOD at that time of day when there are NO Mods on the site. The site gets spammed with less than legitimate posts and threads, and a clean up must be made ASAP to remove the offending links that may have Trojans or Phishing software encoded into them.  The first Mod on site will likely have to deal immediately with the 'invasion'.  There should be no need for a discussion and quorum to solve many of the problems, such as this, that the Mods have in actuality already been doing behind the scenes.

When it does come to the Warning System, the Mods have in 99% of the cases recorded all the steps taken with the more serious cases, discussed when necessary, and implemented the Warning.  In many cases of Banning a member, the Mods have had long discussions, and used the steps in the Warning System before going that route with the member.....Not to be confused with Banning immediately Spammers and Trolls who obviously had no interest in following site rules. 
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Offline Journeyman

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #51 on: April 22, 2017, 10:47:13 »
Sort of like this but actually used?
Wow....now there  were some bad examples from the past.   :pop:

Offline MOOXE

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #52 on: April 22, 2017, 11:47:53 »
Just to clarify my view on the warning system. If it worked that's good but the colours combined with the amount of warnings made it extremely visible. What would catch someones eye the most? Red banners, red text, red flags. Turn the volume down is what I mean.

Offline the 48th regulator

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #53 on: April 25, 2017, 20:24:57 »
A proposal I would also like to offer. 

If you want to become member of the staff, Mentor or Moderator, then you MUST be a current paid subscriber to the forum.

Mike, you need support.  Not just the kind where people issues warnings, and lecture the young.  We need financial support, and if people think this place is a free ride, then they just don't get it.

Yes, general membership it does not require a Subscription.  However, after a certain period, or acquiring extra privileges, I think it is only fair to ask for contributions to the site.

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Offline dapaterson

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #54 on: April 25, 2017, 21:19:53 »
I'm a bit torn.  I like the idea of people showing commitment and support; but I'm also aware that there are folks (especially younger ones) who perhaps can't contribute money, but would be willing to contribute time - time that some of us old farts more mature members who are able to give money perhaps can't give.

Like I said, I'm torn.  I agree that we want to give strong incentives to provide financial support to the site; but at the same time I don't want staff to be limited to old guys like me.

But it is a really interesting idea, that I'm going to have to mull over more.
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Offline mariomike

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #55 on: April 25, 2017, 21:43:28 »
If you want to become member of the staff, Mentor or Moderator, then you MUST be a current paid subscriber to the forum.

Still only 8 cents a day,
https://army.ca/subscribe/
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Offline the 48th regulator

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #56 on: April 25, 2017, 22:37:42 »
I'm a bit torn.  I like the idea of people showing commitment and support; but I'm also aware that there are folks (especially younger ones) who perhaps can't contribute money, but would be willing to contribute time - time that some of us old farts more mature members who are able to give money perhaps can't give.

Like I said, I'm torn.  I agree that we want to give strong incentives to provide financial support to the site; but at the same time I don't want staff to be limited to old guys like me.

But it is a really interesting idea, that I'm going to have to mull over more.

Believe me, there were times I couldnot pay, so I agree with your angst.

However, we are in stringent times, and Mike is making a huge effort in keeping this alive.  He has reset the staff, and wishes to move onto to bigger and better things.  I think it is only fair to ask that if you want the "Privilege"  (Which let us be candid, it is) of managing the site on behalf of Mike, then you should also be able to contribute to it's survival monetarily.

This is the first example of peer support.  Virtual Legion.  Information Library.

The onus is on all of us to contribute, not just posting thoughts and memes.  All clubs do it, so should we.

Come on folks! Pony up- Mike should not have to dip into his own pocket.

While I prefer not to subscribe (for my own reasons) to do write a cheque periodically that (at least) equals the cost of an annual subscription.

 Maybe you don't have the cost of a full subscription right now- $5. $10. It all helps!

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Offline Ayrsayle

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #57 on: April 25, 2017, 23:11:30 »
I would agree with 48th Regulator - members who are interested in the long term growth of the site and the value it provides would likely stick around for the long haul (which really, I think Mike is looking for from his "Moderators").  investing your money into a project has a way of making you care about the end product.

Also agree that not everyone can pay the money required for the membership - I think it is one of the greatest things about this site is that those who can/wish to contribute do but that the information is always available to everyone. I'll happily continue to support the site for all that it provides, etc.

It's the classic "people won't know what they had until its gone" scenario - hopefully it never gets to that point.
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Offline GAP

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #58 on: April 26, 2017, 00:01:57 »
That's baloney!!

There isn't anyone out there that can't afford $35.00 a year.

A few timmies, a couple lottery tickets, going to a movie.....
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #59 on: April 26, 2017, 00:14:18 »
I'm a bit torn.  I like the idea of people showing commitment and support; but I'm also aware that there are folks (especially younger ones) who perhaps can't contribute money, but would be willing to contribute time - time that some of us old farts more mature members who are able to give money perhaps can't give.

Like I said, I'm torn.  I agree that we want to give strong incentives to provide financial support to the site; but at the same time I don't want staff to be limited to old guys like me.

But it is a really interesting idea, that I'm going to have to mull over more.


I'm going to hop on board and donate.

Personally I would be against the idea of members being required to be paying members to moderate. I think it could take away the impartialaity of being a moderator and be viewed as a sense of privilege or elitism. Really bring attention (and pressure) to subscribers vs non-subscribers.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2017, 00:16:50 by Jarnhamar »
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Offline mariomike

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #60 on: April 26, 2017, 07:04:26 »
There isn't anyone out there that can't afford $35.00 a year.

Not even that.

"An Army.ca Subscription is an annual payment of $30"
https://army.ca/subscribe/

I've read on here that support for the CAF is, "A mile wide and an inch deep."

Hopefully, the same can not be said of milnet.ca
 
« Last Edit: April 26, 2017, 07:07:11 by mariomike »
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Offline Mike Bobbitt

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #61 on: April 26, 2017, 07:14:26 »
Requiring Staff to subscribe is a good idea on the surface, but I have been very hesitant to coerce people into financial support. I would much prefer to see that come from E.G. advertisers if possible.

In fact, I almost see things from the opposite point of view... as Staff you are already giving back to the site in it's daily operation; no need to pay for that "privilege" as you are already paying your dues. In a perfect world, I could even pay the Staff, but we are a long way from that I'm afraid. (In our 24+ years of operation, no-one has ever been paid, myself included.)

In the end, I feel strongly that Army.ca has to be a free service for all, but with options to support (financially, or via contribution) for those who are able.

And I do realize not everyone is in a position to support. I would no more demand financial support from my Staff than I would demand Subscribers "get out there and clean things up." ;) Support from those who can, when they can, has kept this site alive and I appreciate the help in whatever form it takes.


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Offline ModlrMike

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #62 on: April 26, 2017, 11:07:15 »
I don't know if this has been suggested up thread, but what about incognito moderation? What I mean is that under the current model, if I'm a moderator and I intervene in a discussion, disclaimers aside people are going to see me as a moderator. If there was a way to moderate where the member's identity was not disclosed, that would allow moderators to continue to discuss topics in the open as themselves. I realize it may be challenging to manage, but perhaps separate accounts... Moderator1, Moderator2 etc, etc.
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Offline mariomike

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #63 on: April 26, 2017, 11:21:50 »
I don't know if this has been suggested up thread, but what about incognito moderation?

Undercover Moderators?
http://neowiki.neoseeker.com/wiki/Undercover_moderator
The identity of undercover moderators are known only to members of the administration.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2017, 11:27:33 by mariomike »
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Offline George Wallace

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #64 on: April 26, 2017, 11:24:25 »
I have a distaste for any organization that permits people to act like 18th Century English land owners buying their way to top of the British Army and Navy.  I would hate to think of my donations in the past as being the reason I became a Mod; although I had never given it much thought until this suggestion was made.  I prefer to think that Mike choose his Moderators for their capabilities to fulfill the duties required of them, not for their financial support. 
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Offline Simian Turner

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #65 on: April 26, 2017, 12:01:24 »
Since the site is known as Army.ca why not initiate a process of duty staff based on seniority and responsibilities:

CDS/Comd/Cmdt/CO - Mike
Duty Field Officer
Duty Officer
Duty Sgt
Duty NCM

Mike used to publish - Routine Orders - site usage

Special Routine Orders could be used for Warnings and Bans

Significant Incident Reports - could be made public or classified (staff only)

I am sure there is a lot of other terminology that could be adopted/adapted.



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Offline George Wallace

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #66 on: April 26, 2017, 12:06:14 »
Since the site is known as Army.ca why not initiate a process of duty staff based on seniority and responsibilities:

CDS/Comd/Cmdt/CO - Mike
Duty Field Officer
Duty Officer
Duty Sgt
Duty NCM

Mike used to publish - Routine Orders - site usage

Special Routine Orders could be used for Warnings and Bans

Significant Incident Reports - could be made public or classified (staff only)

I am sure there is a lot of other terminology that could be adopted/adapted.

You left out the OR staff who would have to compile, write up, edit and promulgate said Routine Orders....... >:D
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Offline GAP

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #67 on: April 26, 2017, 13:25:22 »
what about all the annex's ?
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #68 on: April 26, 2017, 14:24:00 »
I don't know if this has been suggested up thread, but what about incognito moderation? What I mean is that under the current model, if I'm a moderator and I intervene in a discussion, disclaimers aside people are going to see me as a moderator. If there was a way to moderate where the member's identity was not disclosed, that would allow moderators to continue to discuss topics in the open as themselves. I realize it may be challenging to manage, but perhaps separate accounts... Moderator1, Moderator2 etc, etc.

I thought about that too. A counter point would be if I was debating /arguing with a member who was also a moderator on a touchy subject and all of a sudden "moderator 1" jumps in and gives me a warning I would immediately question if the moderator jumped into the anonymous account and gave me a warning.  Imo it makes moderating less transparent and could enable unfair treatment. 
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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #69 on: April 26, 2017, 16:57:59 »
Agreed on the above in a big way.

Moderation of threads, posts, or people, IMO, has to have accountability to the site's members - because it's your site as much as it is ours or Mike's. Yeah, Mike owns the joint and so what he says goes. The Staff take direction from Mike and administer the site, so I guess what they say should go (in most cases and with caveats, of course) too. But without the members posting in the threads then it's just the mods and Mike and how boring would that be? So it's yours.

With that said, I have no issue when my name is attached to an edit of a post, for whatever the reason. Because I expect to have to answer for it if it's questionable in any way. I can't give you a count of how many times that has happened to me, but it's pretty low and I never mind the interaction.

Further, I have zero issue posting quickly to say I have locked a thread and usually, for the very most part, it's accepted without question. When I get a PM asking for it to be opened then I get to have an chat about why and usually that's cool.

I also try to follow up with people when I delete posts. It doesn't always happen, and for that I can blame nothing but time, but I think, again, for the most part it does.

Lastly, users getting warnings know who is giving it to them and the reason. Again, it's not often I have had to explain myself too much further.

But, all in all, transparency is one of the things I think we have going for us and I welcome it.

Based on my experience as staff here, I see loads of great ideas in this thread. Mike's taking notes, so do not be shy.

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Offline Simian Turner

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #70 on: April 26, 2017, 18:28:32 »
George,

It is funny that you mentioned the OR staff.  A unit I am familiar with recently re-instituted a monthly newsletter - there was no shortage of recipes, jokes, and other non-unit related submissions but getting people to submit relevant, timely content was like pulling teeth.  As I was considering the ROs aspect (albeit briefly) it could be a matter of a link to army.ca wiki with a staff list showing their levels of authority and responsibilities.  I have always been amazed at how few staff seemed to be doing so much in so many places.  Whereas, in reality that I/no one ever had access to a staff list.  Now maybe being overt in a site where most people use changeable nicknames is silly.

In keeping with my original thoughts, would it be a useful and progressive concept that all future moderators use actual names or keep with nicknames?  Would this add credibility or be irrelevant as people could continue to take on a nom de plume and be whoever they want - real or imagined.
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Offline George Wallace

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #71 on: April 26, 2017, 18:35:30 »
In keeping with my original thoughts, would it be a useful and progressive concept that all future moderators use actual names or keep with nicknames?  Would this add credibility or be irrelevant as people could continue to take on a nom de plume and be whoever they want - real or imagined.

Mike has not laid down any rules about what one uses as a screen name on the site.  I remember several years ago we did have a discussion among the membership on whether it was a good idea or not to use their real names.  It is a Security Issue, and one that is left up to the individual as to what they want to do with their PERSEC.  Some of the Mods did use their real names, others just their initials and others a screen name, while some used a series of screen names.  Again, Mike did not have any rule for any member of the site to follow, Moderator or not, in respect to how they were identified; and I am absolutely sure he will not put such a rule into place.

As an aside, I have had several members of the CAF who have identified me and have had many negative things to say, about me and/or the site.  I suspect many of those same pers were malcontents who had tried to be disruptive on the site and perhaps banned or otherwise put on the WARNING SYSTEM.  You will find many of these same types have left here for such sites as REDDIT, where the atmosphere was more to their liking.  Others have had nothing but praise for the site and the way that Mike runs it.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2017, 18:45:20 by George Wallace »
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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #72 on: April 26, 2017, 19:20:58 »
I remember several years ago we did have a discussion among the membership on whether it was a good idea or not to use their real names. 

Real names might discourage the trolling.

Official forum changes, real life names to be displayed (at Blizzard) 
http://army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=95195.0
"In an interesting development to change the tone of their forums and put names to the trolls, they are having users' real names appear next to all of their forum posts."

For those who like to change their online aliases, it's nice when they announce their name changes,

Please announce all name changes here
http://army.ca/forums/index.php/board,86.0.html

« Last Edit: April 26, 2017, 22:30:23 by mariomike »
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Offline the 48th regulator

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #73 on: April 26, 2017, 22:47:06 »
Question for you Mike.

Say a person that is not a member, joins the forum.  Has all the criteria as a vet.  SME in many topics.

If they applied, is it possible for them to become a Moderator?

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Re: Army.ca Staff Reset
« Reply #74 on: April 26, 2017, 23:11:01 »
Sorry, spin it however, but I am against any effort whatsoever, to silence moderator s voicing their personal opinion.

You can't ask anyone to come here and moderate only, denying them the right to voice their legal opinion.

Last I looked we're still in Canada.
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